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Brawn from pork loin?
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Message 1.Â
Posted by carrick-bend (U2288869) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
It simply wouldn't work - there isn't anything in pork loin which would cook down and make the jelly which characterises brawn.
Pork loin is, in fact, the bit of the pig which would be most difficult to make brawn from.
And it's one of the most expensive bits.
Why did Jill want to do this?
(It's all cooked down - would anyone object to pate?) -
Message 2
Posted by SteveKills (U14949122) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
Look at recipes from Jamie Oliver, Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall and the River cafe´and ALL of them use pig's head because that is what you use for brawn. Brains, cheek meat etc. Are the SWs too lazy even to Google it?
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Message 3
Posted by Vanya (U15511509) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
It simply wouldn't work - there isn't anything in pork loin which would cook down and make the jelly which characterises brawn.
Pork loin is, in fact, the bit of the pig which would be most difficult to make brawn from.
And it's one of the most expensive bits.
Why did Jill want to do this?
(It's all cooked down - would anyone object to pate?) Â Because the SW's know nothing about traditional cooking. I expect they watch the fancy TV shows or shop at some upmarket supermarket.
You are right: it is impossible to get the jelly from loin! -
Message 4
Posted by cherrytree (U9175528) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
It;'s as if there are two different programmes on the go at once. We hear ad nauseum about Tom's pigs and then out of the blue we learn that Jill a traditional and capable cook who could cope with pigs' extremities without turning a hair is cooking pork loin to make a brawn. It doesn't make any sense at all.
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Message 5
Posted by Organoleptic Icon (U11219171) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
You are right: it is impossible to get the jelly from loin!Â
You possibly could, slow cooked long enough.
Or you could use gelatin.
But Jill would certainly know better. You could make brawn with all sorts of bits which would not put people off. -
Message 6
Posted by Spartacus (U38364) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
Is it possible that Jill just put it about that she would be using loin to avoid putting off the squeamish?
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Message 7
Posted by Tabashir (U15283723) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
Haven't been around for a while, but 'plus ça change...', it seems.
I'm thinking it might be less stressful, and save so much time for all concerned, if the SWs would just link to the websites from which they're garnering their information.
Remember the ''Pad' on a horses hoof Tayler?' thread, where it turned out the SWs had 'borrowed' text from a US equine site - which made no sense at all when mouthed by Chris, a UK farrier?
Seems the same's happening here. I don't think any normal recipe would suggest making Brawn from anything other than those portions of a beast heavy in bone/gelatin (yep OI, I appreciate it *could* be done, but... WHY?) yet out there interwetwide, I'll bet good money there's someone hot for 'Loin Brawn' - with a recipe all tested and posted...
...and well done SWs for tracking it down! Perhaps you could direct us to it? I'd be more than prepared to give 'Lumpypigbackgello' a try, for novelty value alone!
TIA -
Message 8
Posted by carrick-bend (U2288869) on Wednesday, 5th December 2012
This interweb page about brawn seems comprehensive and amusing (but doesn't mention loin...)
I myself found the "horse pad" site - it was rather strange, indeed, to find Chris quoting it. -
Message 9
Posted by Tayler Cresswell - Host (U14232848) on Thursday, 6th December 2012
Hi all
a quick google brought this Elizabethan recipe up
Tayler -
Message 10
Posted by Organoleptic Icon (U11219171) on Thursday, 6th December 2012
The original! Out of copyright I suspect.
I particularly liked ANEVV Booke of Cookerie, by Thomas Gloning, 1615.
To sowce a Pigge.
SCald a large Pigge, cut off his headand slit him in the
middest, and takeout his bones, and wash him in two orthree warme waters. Then
collar himvp like Brawne, and sowe the collarsin a fayre cloth. Then boyle them
verytender in faire water, then take themvp and throw them in fayre water
andSalt vntill they be colde, for that willmake the skinne white. Then tace
apottle of the same water, that the Piggewas boyled in, and a pottle of
whiteWine, a race of Ginger sliced, a coupleof Nutmegs quartered, a spoonefull
of<>whole Pepper, fiue or sixe Bayleaues:seeth all this
together, when it is coldeput your Pigge into the sowce-drincke,so you may keepe
it halfe a yeere, butspend the head. -
Message 11
Posted by carrick-bend (U2288869) on Thursday, 6th December 2012
Tayler, that recipe is a modern "redaction" of "To Sowce a Pigge" (To souse, or pickle, pork - I grew up with Soused Mackerel)
Here's a later version -
A "collar" is a parcel - A collar that you wear made a convenient parcel of the neck.
It's all a bit circular - Robert said that to make it with the head would upset people, so Jill was doing it with loin, but you've found a modern version of a recipe that's a bit different than the one that Robert was referring to anyway!
It's all very confusing, but as Lynda is probably the only person that would be concerned with authenticity, and if Jill's cooking it, it would be nice, and it'll be cold.... -
Message 12
Posted by Organoleptic Icon (U11219171) on Thursday, 6th December 2012
A "collar" is a parcel - A collar that you wear made a convenient parcel of the neck.Â
c-b - I think not, as collar is from Latin collum - neck.
I think in the cooking sense "collar" meant what we would now call "roll". To wrap meat inside a roll of its own skin.
What interests me more is that where to me, "brawn" means obnoxious bits of pig set in jelly it seems that it originally meant simply meat, and only later and in English to get to be pork, then preserved pork.
Brawn
3. spec. The flesh of the boar. (Often defined as ‘brawn of a boar’, even in 16th c.) In recent use, the flesh of a boar (or swine), collared, boiled, and pickled or potted. [With the restriction of application we may compare the restriction of bacon, a derivative of back, to the cured back and sides of the pig.]
And it is the same word as Bradan meaning Roast!
6. Cookery.
Thesaurus »
Categories »
a. ‘To roll up (a piece of meat, a fish, etc.) and bind it hard and close with a string’ (Johnson).
Categories »
b. to cut up and press into a roll (see collared adj. 4).
c1670 MS. Cookery Bk., To Coller Pigg.
1737 Compl. Family-piece (ed. 2) i. ii. 149 To collar a Breast of Veal.
1769 E. Raffald Experienced Eng. Housekeeper (1778) 43 To collar Mackarel.
1769 E. Raffald Experienced Eng. Housekeeper (1778) 303 To collar Beef. -
Message 13
Posted by SteveKills (U14949122) on Friday, 7th December 2012
Morning CB. In old English a braun was a boar. In Co Durham a village called Brancepeth was originally the path of the boar or braun. If one prepares brawn these days it is from pig's head. It would appear that the ridiculous Lynda would do well to see if there is any of Jo and Edday's maggot ridden wild boar carcass left.
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Message 14
Posted by Organoleptic Icon (U11219171) on Friday, 7th December 2012
In reply to Country Squire:
Morning CB. In old English a braun was a boar.Â
Not, Squire, according to the OED. Closest it got was "the flesh of a boar" but not the beast itself. -
Message 15
Posted by shulascat (U14737252) on Friday, 7th December 2012
I suggest this recipe has been both Americanised and sanitised for the sake of the squeamish. Jill should know better. Her generation is probably the last to have made brawn from pigs' heads and trotters. My mother often cooked trotters and the resulting brawn was delicious. My grandma regularly cooked pigs' head, together with shin of beef to give it more flavour. I have the recipe but have never fancied trying it - but Jill lives on a farm, for goodness sake.
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Message 16
Posted by Chris Ghoti (U10794176) on Monday, 10th December 2012
And Lynda seems to think that brawn used to be made from offal.
Ms Tayler, has the team found a recipe for brawn that involves offal? -
Message 17
Posted by JacksParakeetBeingDe-Nested (U2979858) on Monday, 10th December 2012
I hope it hasn't: would not adding any offal greatly affect the appearance and taste of the brawn?
jp -
Message 18
Posted by Chris Ghoti (U10794176) on Monday, 10th December 2012
Lybda definitely said that "it was originally made from pig offal." Not even "with": from.
Does anyone reckon they will find a version of brawn made *from* offal? Bearing in mind that the head and feet of an animal are *not* inside it? -
Message 19
Posted by shulascat (U14737252) on Monday, 10th December 2012
Didn't they use the brain to create a pretty pattern inside the brawn?
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Message 20
Posted by Chris Ghoti (U10794176) on Monday, 10th December 2012
That would be "with", but not "from", I think.
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Message 21
Posted by Organoleptic Icon (U11219171) on Monday, 10th December 2012
Lybda definitely said that "it was originally made from pig offal." Not even "with": from.
Does anyone reckon they will find a version of brawn made *from* offal? Bearing in mind that the head and feet of an animal are *not* inside it?Â
Actually the OED seems to think head can be called offal!
a. The edible parts collectively which are cut off in preparing the carcass of an animal for food. In early use applied mainly to the entrails; later extended to include the head, tail, and internal organs such as the heart, liver, etc. Â
Lyndibotts talks of a "recreation using loin in jelly" Sounds perfectly credible to me - though I wouldd use shoulder.
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