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Sibling probems, any experience?
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Message 1.Â
Posted by RosaGallica (U3612905) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
I've posted about this before, but just to prove I don't learn from experience - here I go again. My last posting about this was because my son was in hospital and despite knowing about it, my sister never once enquired as to how he was doing, despite the fact she regularly calls me to go into great details about her life travails. I have often been of considerable support to her, which I don't begrudge. Well I think I am beginnning to now.
Currently my son (early twenties) is in hospital again, having been admitted Sunday night. He has severe abdo pain and they are suspecting kidney probs, bile duct probs, or something else. The pain still isn't under control but it is a very good hospital and I feel happy he is in good hands.
Now my sister works in the said hospital which is at least an hours drive from home. Since he has been there(which she knew about) she hasn't been to see him, though it wouldn't be difficult, or enquired as to how he is doing. They don't have a history of not getting on, she just seems to have this thing about conspicuous 'I'm not interested in your family'.
Naturally we visit him daily, but it would be reassuring to also have him visited by another family member, nice for him too.
What I can't understand is why I always get disappointed by her behaviour? It's not as if I haven't seen it before, she is nothing if not consistent. She visited me last week, bringing her new man to meet me, spending time with the demented parent I care for. Then two days later she called me to ask if she could have some money from AP's account - we have P of A - a few hundred quid. There are always strings attached!
My question here is not why does she behave like this but rather why am I always hurt and disappointed when she does? She knows she can rely on me to help her out yet almost seems to rub my nose in the fact she is totally uncaring about me and my family. I think I need to rethink some family dynamics here, but it isn't always easy to work off logic in these matters.
I hope I haven't rambled, I've been a bit short of sleep lately. -
Message 2
Posted by Dunlurkin NL (U2675855) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
It's not called rambling RG, rather getting it off your chest.
Sorry to hear that your worries about your son are being compunded by totally unnecessary frustration and anger about your sister. (I don't mean you should be frustrated and angry, more that she shouldn't be doing the things that cause you frustration and anger.)
So she can drive a hour to show off her new man (with a view to getting £££s out of it) but can't be bothered to walk up a flight of stairs to see how her nephew is doing. Do you have number screening on your phone?
I'm not being of any help, I'm sure. Just didn't want to leave you dangling.
Dunlurkin -
Message 3
Posted by Sixties Relic SAVE ML (U13777237) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
I have had a tricky relationship with my sister all of our lives.
I think one of the problems is that for some reason it is easy to bottle things up with relatives. IMO, she really needs to know how you feel.
My mother was like this with my sister - kept it all inside, was constantly disappointed by her but never said anything in order tho "keep the peace". She would ask for things obliquely because she was afaid of rejection.
In my sister's eyes, this lack of directness was seen as "deviousness".
So phone her up, tell how how disappointed you are that she has not been to visit her nephew. Blow the consequences - it couldn't be any worse, could it? -
Message 4
Posted by notjenniferaldrich (U8555450) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
My MiL had a brother (both deceased now) who behaved very badly towards her. Her misery and disappointment were (to me) hard to understand. I couldn't comprehend why she didn't just write him off. But she couldn't and suffered mightily.
My SiL and the uncle's children are now cordial and in touch with each other and behave like normal family members. It has always been a mystery to me.
In my own family, the contact is always up to me. I know my brothers are not unfond of me, but they never get in touch or enquire after my family unless I ring or write first. Except when I was in hospital, then they sent flowers, which touched me very deeply.
Can't explain it, but you're apparently not alone. -
Message 5
Posted by rainbowAlison (U6855649) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
RosaGallica, I think you should simply ask your sister to visit your son and see what she says - and does. It is, of course, odd that you should have to ask such a thing, but it seems that she's just one of those people who can't/won't see beyond their own concerns until given a sharp wake-up call.
One thing's for certain: people who are allowed to get away with bad behaviour won't change until those around them stop putting up with it.
It's up to you. Good luck. -
Message 6
Posted by Miladou bloody but unbowed (U3518248) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Thu, 11 Jun 2009 10:46 GMT, in reply to RosaGallica in message 1
"What I can't understand is why I always get disappointed by her behaviour?"
Because you haven't yet come to accept that we can only expect from other people what they are prepared to give. And in the case of your sister, this seems to be nothing at all. I have the same situation in my own family and it took me many, many years to get to the point where I'm no longer hurt by it. You just need to distance yourself. If it doesn't occur to her to visit her nephew, then it's odd, but there's nothing you can do except refuse to be upset by it. It's just how she is.
Having said that, I'm amazed that she's taking money from your AP's account. I have P of A for my AP, but only ever use it to settle her care home bills. I'd send her away with a flea in her ear for that one! -
Message 7
Posted by RosaGallica (U3612905) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Thanks all for your replies.
miladou - My sister is using the part of PofA which states something about giving of gifts. without looking it up, there is a clause which talks about attorneys being able to give reasonable gifts, which would not leave AP (in our case) short of money. This is very unlegalese language, but I think that's the gist. As it happens I told her he didn't have enough in his current account to cover her request. I will have to read the paperwork again.
In the last few weeks she has taken a couple of his conservatory chairs -'He'll never need them' and some of his decorative plant pots. Granted he won't need them but to me it seems like grave-robbing. Only he isn't dead!
As for her lack of interest in my son - who is in more pain today BTW
I guess I need to either speak to her directly and/or accept that this is how she is. Interestingly I remember helping her to go through the same process with our late mother regarding accepting the fact that she was a cold, uninterested mother. Hmmmm.
Dunlurkin - thank-you, that's how I feel, you can *-well drive over here if you think you can get something out of it, but a couple of flights of stairs are too much eh?
sixtiesrelic - I know I am bottling this up, although I seem to be the only one in my family who doesn't just tell it like it is! My 'family-of-origin' that is. I think the adult thing to do would be what both you and rainbowAlison suggest - just straight talk. For some reason the thought horrifies me. However I know I am far from the only person around who would choose to back away from a confrontation with my sister. I might try and gird my loins. On the other hand I might do what notjen suggests and write her off.
What I do need to do is come to terms with the fact that as far as she is concerned, this is it. This is all she will do. Nothing. -
Message 8
Posted by notjenniferaldrich (U8555450) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Poor you, worried about your son and with your inconsiderate sister on your mind.
We don't choose our relatives, but growing up with siblings definitely creates invisible bonds between them. I can understand how hard it is for you to let go of your expectations. We have a vision of what a sister ought to be and do, based on our early lives together, and yours is obviously off the radar on your screen. Perhaps if you understand your own expectations better, it might be easier for you to decide that your sister doesn't really belong in your life at all, and then she can't upset you by ignoring you. From outside the situation, it's hard to grasp quite why you care so much what she does. If she were not your sister, surely you would not expect her to visit your son etc. but would dismiss her as an uncaring, selfish person not worthy to be your friend.
I had brothers, and always thought I would like to have a sister instead. I would have swapped all three for one sister. And when I went off to university, I was always in search of a bosom friend as a kind of ersatz sister. Needless to say, I had to cope with many disappointments, mostly due to my own expectations and imagined visions of what a sister might be like.
It sounds as if you'd be happier if you were free of your sister, like imagining she's at the other end of the world and not available for visits etc. Maybe then you could gain some emotional distance from her, as she doesn't seem likely to function in the way you want her to. -
Message 9
Posted by Silver Jenny (U12795676) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
RoseGallica, I am sorry to hear about your son's illness. Hope the doctors can get pain relief sorted soo and diagnose the cause.
I have no experience of siblings personally. Notjen has said I what was thinking. If you can decide that your sister has nothing to offer in the way of support for you or your family, it would be easier for you, wouldn't it. Don't beat yourself up; she is one of those who doesn't do support. Of course that works the other way. No support available for her from AP's money.
One tiny warning bell rang with mention of the new man in her life. Could the pressure to get money be coming from him, and if so, would it just stop at a few hundred? Possibly now is the time to say you cannot give money from the AP's account because it is needed to pay for his care. No discussion or special pleading, you have PoA. You need your strength and attention for AP and your son and to keep yourself strong for them. Take care of yourself. -
Message 10
Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Rosa, I am with those who say talk to her. Just say something like, your son would really appreciate more visitors, and as she'll be there, please could she pop in too.
I don't know what her reasons are (maybe even she doesn't), but I know that I am far more likely to wait to be asked than to ask myself - yes, I want to go and see someone, but I don't want to feel in the way, or that I'm pushing in when it wouldn't be helpful. (Have to say, this isn't the impression I'm getting from your sister, but we only have your side of it, and you don't know either, so it's all open to speculation, which probably won't get us anywhere anyway.)
I rarely use the phone, it's just not my favoured form of communication, and until the last couple of weeks or so, where I feel like I've been almost glued to the damned thing, I can easily have a monthly phone bill for 0p (on calls.) But I do email. However, with my sister, we mostly heard about each other through my mother - it's only the last 6 weeks or so, since we realised she wasn't coping any more, that we've really talked together about anything much. I won't say things are perfect, but we're probably closer than we've ever been before, and it's been interesting how many similar reactions and feelings we've both had about our mother. But it wouldn't have happened if we hadn't both decided to be open, and that wouldn't have happened had we not had the catalyst of circumstances. Maybe you can use your son being in hospital as the catalyst - but it does take two - if she won't change at all, then maybe it's time to accept that she won't change, and you just have to accept that she only gives the little she's given and no more. People don't always behave as we want them to, even when it seems the most sensible to us.
I hope all works out well, whichever way it goes, and best wishes to your son. -
Message 11
Posted by BlueLagoon (U7609387) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
I might try writing a letter in which you can remain calm and say the words you want to without becoming upset or nervous. Paragraph by paragraph you could describe your feelings and your hurt. Your sister could choose to take this on board or remain her usual self centred way.
Also I find distancing myself a great help. Different situation but I had a good friend for some years who became quite nasty and two faced about other people (probably me too behind my back). It got to the point that I felt uncomfortable and compromised to be her friend as she was slating people I liked. I made myself gradually unavailable, not return texts, avoid places she was at, just not be there for her in the manner I was before (loyal hound that I was). It was so liberating and I felt so free to be away from this person - she's not living rent free in my head now! Your sister doesn't even have to know why you are distancing yourself from her. Just not be around to pick up calls, texts or even knocks at the door.
I hope your son is feeling better today. He has all the right people in his life that he needs so blow her! -
Message 12
Posted by peskylogin (U2369503) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Are you quite sure son wants a visit from a miserable, self-seeking old auntie? Hospital bedside chats are pretty strained at the best of times (being overheard etc).
-
Message 13
Posted by JustJezebel (U7474974) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
I think Peskylogin makes a good point here Rosa! Would your son really appreciate a visit from your sister?
I believe there's no shame in deciding that your sister isn't really someone you like enough to want to be part of your regular life. It seems as if she doesn't view the bond of sisterhood in the same way as you do and maybe you'd be happier about it if you had lower expectations of her, rather than hoping for her better nature to shine through.
I do feel for you though, it's hard when people we love constantly disappoint.
Hope your son recovers soon.
JJ -
Message 14
Posted by Hazel Wooley (U2338026) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Poor you, Rose. I know extremely well how awful it is to have a sibling who constantly disappoints. Sadly, I don't think sibling petty rivalries go away after the 21st birthday. You sister probably knows full well what she's doing in terms of annoying you etc etc. My own brother used to do these kinds of things and I tried my damndest to make our relationship work on an amicable level. But after both our parents died, his gloves really came off and I realised how jealous he had been of me all of his life (he's a lot older than me). After all the legal stuff was done and dusted I haven't made any effort to contact him. At first I was very sad about our lost relationship, but then I realised that I was mourning the loss of something that had never existed. I'm comfortable now with the status quo.
I do hope that your son is improving in hospital. You must be really worried and I'm sending good wishes for his speedy recovery.
HW -
Message 15
Posted by JoleBlon (U12091094) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
Well said, peskylogin and JustJezebel.
I no longer have contact with those of my siblings who take and take and never give. Life's too short to be taken for granted full-time, in my opinion, and they were told, firmly and politely, never to darken my door again. Your sister reminds me strongly of them - only interested in what she can get and leaves you to manage all the awkward tough stuff that she doesn't want to deal with. No point giving her more rope - she only ties you in knots with it. Let her be. Don't inflict her on your poorly son - especially if he will get no joy from her visit! - and drop contact with her. The audacity of taking things so callously like that! She could be one of my siblings, for sure.
Sorry for being so blunt - and ignore me by all means! - but she's no good for you or yours so why keep beating yourself up trying to develop a bond that doesn't exist from her side? -
Message 16
Posted by Celtic Tiger (U2229153) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
<"What I can't understand is why I always get disappointed by her behaviour?">
Because people have a picture of how their relatives should behave, based on an ideal. We are a lot more realistic about our friends. If a "friend" of yours behaved to you and your son like your sister is doing, you would long ago have dropped them from your friendship circle. Unfortunately you can't stop her from being your sister. -
Message 17
Posted by Hazel Wooley (U2338026) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
>Because people have a picture of how their relatives should behave, based on an ideal. We are a lot more realistic about our friends. If a "friend" of yours behaved to you and your son like your sister is doing, you would long ago have dropped them from your friendship circle. Unfortunately you can't stop her from being your sister.<
Totally agree, CTA. We have a mental image of the sort of sibling we would like and hang on to it long after we would have given it up if it were a friend.
Also agree that the son might not want a visit from the self seeking auntie.
HW -
Message 18
Posted by Ex Tram Driver (U5244457) on Thursday, 11th June 2009
This thread has been making me think about my own family. We have an uncle (Dad's brother) which we haven't heard from in 20 years, and we couldn't contact him to tell him that Dad had died. (We could still be contacted at the old address, so that wasn't an issue.) However, he certainly held on to things which our grandparents wanted to be passed on to my parents - apparently Gran wanted her sewing machine to go to Mum, but this was allowed to go to someone in the street instead...
As you might imagine, we didn't try very hard to contact him.
With this in mind, I'm not surprised that contact has not been made despite working in the same hospital, and that she's trying to get what she can. Certainly, there seems no reason to give her any money and the removal of goods without explicit approval is close to theft IMO.
Bearhug's comment about not talking to your siblings also struck a chord; I don't make a point of speaking regularly to brother and sister, as we mainly communicate through my mother. Opening a regular line of communication would be a good idea, as we do get on quite well!
XTD -
Message 19
Posted by RosaGallica (U3612905) on Friday, 12th June 2009
Thank-you for all your replies. I don't feel up to individual replies right now - had just arrived at Addenbrookes to visit son last night (still no improvement) when we had a call from home as another child had a medical emergency and we spent many hours in a different hospital!
What are the chances eh?
Second child is now safely back home, but follow-ups today etc.
I have given much thought to your advice. I realised that my hopes for my sister to visit son were based on my feelings not his! Now who is being self-centred? He has no particular desire for a visit from her. I just wished she would show the kind of sisterly feeling she expects from me. In the last couple of years I have helped her through a very difficult mental health problem, after not hearing from her for ten years.
She has behaved very badly towards the demented parent,especially lately. A couple of weeks ago she turned up to do some work on his garden and ended up fiercely arguing and fighting with him. This takes some doing because he soesn't know what day it is even. I ended up calming her (after she arrived at my home), sending her on her way, then finding him wandering distressed and chilled in his garden.
So I think I have been hanging onto the hope of better behaviour in the light of increasing evidence it is not going to happen. As I mentioned upthread, my question was why oh why do I still keep being disappointed? Several of you have given good answers to that. Indeed if she was a friend, she wouldn't be now! Well I need to get over that.
Thanks for your thoughts. Today is doctors visits with one child, care of AP then back to Addenbrookes. Sigh.... -
Message 20
Posted by ThisLizzie (U5294918) on Friday, 12th June 2009
Rosa,
I do feel for you. I don't know why families are like this but my own is very similar.
Since death of AP I've had absolutely no contact from either of my isters an one of them said at the time that she didn't want to ever hear from me again. She's been like this since we were teens and I know from experience she'll be quick to make contact when she wants something.
When said AP was in hospital our family home was virtually emptied by my sister who said that. Most hurtful was discovering that 'precious' or items that everyone knew were promised to certain people were gone. -
Message 21
Posted by notjenniferaldrich (U8555450) on Friday, 12th June 2009
I feel so much for all the posters here who have difficult sibling relationships (or none at all).
My own bros don't get in touch with me, although I know it's not because they don't care. But we are fond of each other, and so I don't mind always being the one to lift the phone or troll over to UK every couple of months. And I love the time we spend in various combinations of together. My nieces never respond to the prezzies we send them (and I have to dial and hold the phone out to my own sprogettes when they're here to make sure they say thanks and stay in touch with my very special SIL). Everyone seems to be absorbed in their own lives but happy to stay in touch if one person makes the effort. It used to be my mum. I lost more than a mum when she died but have tried to make up for it as best I can.
We didn't have any falling out over my mum's illness, care, funeral and estate, thank goodness. Everything was amicably shared out between her two stepsons, my bro and good self, and we are all very fond of the shared memories and things that remind us so much of her.
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