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What should I do?

• Message 1. 

  Posted by Josey (U1242413) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  I heard yesterday of a "situation" that has developed between two senior managers at work. (Won't elucidate for obvious reasons) This is causing serious discontent and worry amongst the staff, who feel even more unsupported than ever, but the people concerned don't know the staff know. I've known both people for many years and have always been really friendly with one of them. I spoke to a line manager today and she said it's up to me whether I tell my senior manager friend about staff concerns. My loyalty is with the staff (I work all over the place but know everyone) but I also really like this person. Help.

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• Message 2

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by Morganish (U9108847) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Wed, 14 Oct 2009 08:41 GMT, in reply to Josey in message 1
  
  As you know one of the managers really well, could you suggest a drink after work or meeting for lunch and have a chat? If you frame it in a friendly and informal way along the lines of: 'Look, this is off the record and I know it's really nothing to do with me but I don't know if you're aware that everyone knows what's going on between you and X. It's causing concern among the groundlings. They're worried that...' and see what your friend says.
  
  Only you, knowing the details of the situation and the people concerned will know if this is a useful/sensible thing to do. I have been in a situation where I was recruited to a job by a senior manager of an organisation who was a friend and I would have felt able to do this. You may not.
  
  Otherwise, I would suggest that you do what you can to quietly reassure other colleagues that this will pass and there's nothing they can do about it, keep your head down and wait for the situation to resolve itself. Good luck.

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• Message 3

  , in reply to message 2.

  Posted by Josey (U1242413) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Thanks, Morganish. One problem is that if I say anything to X then Y will know and this situation happened with Y before - another place, another person, and the staff got into mega trouble even for talking about it. (You might be starting to realise that this situation is also complicated by my concern for X)

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• Message 4

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by rainbowLaure (U8486235) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  I think you should speak to your friend, unofficially. If she is a good manager, she will want to know that something is causing the staff to become unsettled. Once you've let her know, what she does about it is up to her.

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• Message 5

  , in reply to message 3.

  Posted by rainbowLaure (U8486235) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Hmm, complicated. Still think that, if it was me, I would want to know so I could work out how to deal with it.

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• Message 6

  , in reply to message 4.

  Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  I think I would unofficially speak to friend manager.
  
  I have also in the past gone to a manager above the ones squabbling, but I knew he is a very good manager and wouldn't dump me in it, accidentally or otherwise, but would deal with it appropriately. Not every work place has that sort of person in place that it can work like that. Also, depending on the company and its structure, there might not be anyone above them.
  
  Also, I have at times had a name for speaking out rather than just keeping the peace and quietly mumbling away. They do mostly know when I don't agree with them, even if nothing's come of it. More than one manager has described me as a management challenge.
  
  It's a difficult situation, and there isn't necessarily any one right way of reacting to it. A lot depends on the personalities of those involved.

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• Message 7

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by GEm (U4356909) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Josey
  
  While you could have a word with your friend then quite frankly it's an abdication of responsibility but X and Ys line manager to push it back to you. Leaders are responsible for making sure that there is a constructive atmosphere at work. I'd push it back to line manager and say that it would be better if they had a word with the two people concerned and pointed out to them the consequences of their behaviour on others and get them to sort things out
  
  If they behave like children they deserve to be treated like it
  
  G

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• Message 8

  , in reply to message 3.

  Posted by rainbowLaure (U8486235) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  the staff got into mega trouble even for talking about it 
  
  People will always talk - it's foolish to think they won't. If managers don't want them to talk, don't give them anything to talk about.

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• Message 9

  , in reply to message 8.

  Posted by Alsdouble (U524298) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Keep shtum.
  
  I would.

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• Message 10

  , in reply to message 9.

  Posted by Doodlysquat (U13738858) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  "kkep shtumm...I would".
  
  Me too.
  
  suze

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• Message 11

  , in reply to message 10.

  Posted by Kind Mrs Van Rentl (U2315000) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  I wouldn't say anything either, for a number of reasons.
  
  There's the 'shooting the messenger' problem, there's the fact that you would be doing this on behalf of other people, and there's the fact that the other people say they are 'concerned' which often means 'nosy' and 'enjoying a bit of salacious gossip'. If the poo hits the fan, they will melt into the background, leaving you as the bad guy trying to stir it.

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• Message 12

  , in reply to message 11.

  Posted by Morganish (U9108847) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Wed, 14 Oct 2009 12:43 GMT, in reply to Mrs Van Rentl (nee KML) in message 11
  
  This sounds too complicated, Josey. I used to manage creative teams who would twitter and express concern about what was going elsewhere in the organisation - things that had nothing to do with them. 'Concern' sometimes cloaks a vicarious desire to know the gory details.
  
  Perhaps it would be best just to take your friend manager out for a friendly drink one night and be generically and non-specifically supportive as a pal rather than as a colleague.

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• Message 13

  , in reply to message 12.

  Posted by gigglemahanaz (U13930412) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Josey, something similar happened where I used to work at the British Library.
  
  The manager we had left for a new job, he's worked at the BL for a number of years and knew the collections inside out and how the LA's worked as he'd started as one, we got a new manager from "outside" who had no idea, wouldn't help out when we were busy and who had a lot of time off due to her daughter being ill, she also used to bring her personal life into work with her and was generally disliked by the other basemant managers as staff.
  
  After much moaning by the staff in my basement area I was "elected" to speak with her about the way she was carrying on........it didn't go well and I was bascilly told to naff off and mind my own bussiness.....I than got hauled into the grade A's office and was told I was nothing more than a stirer, found out later he'd been the one to employ her!! She carried on as normal, being a real B!
  
  About a year later they were doing volantary redundacy which I applied for and got, by this time I'd had enough of all the bickering and tension and wanted out even though i loved the job, by the time I'd had the acceptance letter the grade C had handed in her notice after being hauled over the coals by the grad A, turns out I was't the only one to have complained about her or the only one to go for redundacy to get away from her as the grade A wouldn't transfer any of us who complained about her.
  
  I guess what I'm rather long windly trying to say is it MAY be better to say nothing at present and see how things go, if it gets much worse thaneither speak to the manager you get on with or go over both thier heads, hopefully you have someone higher than those two who is decent and will give you a fair hearing and importantly won't drop you in it.
  
  Sometimes, as I found to my cost, it's best to stay out of this type of thing and keep your head down and mouth shut, this may be another option to consider.

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• Message 14

  , in reply to message 13.

  Posted by Josey (U1242413) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Thanks everyone. I think, on balance, it's prolly best to say nothing at the mo, just try to be supportive wherever possible. Giggle's story is a good example of what could happen, thanks for posting that, giggles. If X choses to say anything to me it would be different I guess.

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• Message 15

  , in reply to message 13.

  Posted by crossjackrussell (U9607019) on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Do nothing.
  If it affects you in any way ie some of the flak may land on you - accumulate evidence - keep notes store e-mails etc. Otherwise do nowt otherwise the flak will land on you.

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• Message 16

  , in reply to message 15.

  Posted by dean volecape (U1477030) ** on Wednesday, 14th October 2009

  Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:58 GMT, in reply to crossjackrussell in message 15
  accumulating evidence is really important - lots of good advice here from everyone, but don't overlook that one. Keep paper, note conversations, try to get anything you can on paper. I don't know to what extent you can advise others of that key point (useful also because it keeps one on one's own toes).
  
  And remember that emails last for ever and are accessible for ever, so say nothing in a work email you wouldn't be happy to say out loud in front of anyone and everyone.

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