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What are kind words worth?
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Message 1.Â
Posted by Judith Hearne (U7775397) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Someone has posted elsethread along the lines of "Don't post about your RL woes here, all you'll get are kind words, and what are they worth?" (I think the actual term was "pacifying" but I'm hoping to stretch the discussion a bit)
My mother said something similar to me recently: "I don't say nice things to you because it wouldn't achieve anything. Kind words are ten-a-penny, what's really helpful are *solutions* and *action* ..."
I'm here to reassure the issuers of kind words in here that they are worth a great deal, especially to those of us who live in near-total isolation and don't hear another human voice in RL often from one week to the next. I'm a grown-up, I can solve my own practical problems, or try to. What I can't do for myself is generate optimism, self-belief or a new view of a situation, from a vacuum. That's where the kind words come in. Sure, they are of more immediacy in RL, but every single one of them, from any source, counts.
Moot point: It is in fact far *easier* to produce a list of practical solutions to someone's problems, than to think of kind and encouraging things to say. People like my mother are in fact making excuses.
That aside, I wish I were the sort of mighty type who doesn't care what others say or think, or about an outside take on a problem. But I'm a feeble type, and I do.
And I suspect - paradoxically - I'm not alone.
- judith (feeble type) -
Message 2
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Hello Judith,
I'm so glad you have taken those words for the silliness they are.
We only have to read our way through the different threads to see what very great solace those in trouble receive from kind wellwishers here. Very often practical solutions, too, when such is possible. But as we know, a happy solution often isn't to be had. What we all, from time to time, need is the kindness which renews courage so we can pick up our load and carry on. And the kindness of strangers is /never/ to be sniffed at - I know this for a fact.
The fact is that in ML we are very much /here/ for each other - through the laughing as well as the crying times. This is beyond price. -
Message 3
Posted by That Old Janx Spirit (U2140966) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I cannot remember the right figures, but for every unkind word said to someone, it requires X number of kind words to obliterate that one unkind word. People are more likely to remember unkind words; they worm their way into one's conscience.
I am always fascinated by Gok Wan in his How to Look Good Naked programme. He takes people who have been blighted by bad body image all their life - e.g. because of things their mum said to them - and by saying nice things to them, by getting other people to focus on the positive things about the person in question, the person in question ends up feeling happier, more confident.. just like a butterfly. Nothing in their personal life has changed in those 8 weeks. They haven't lost weight, got a new boyfriend or anything, but after the 8 weeks they feel better. Just because some guy has accentuated the positive about them.
And sometimes he does a follow-up programme 18 months later and it's fascinating how much their life has changed for the better since their 'transformation'.
It's so easy to criticise; it's so much better to praise. I've sometimes given out compliments to total strangers - haircuts, a lovely jacket someone was wearing, stuff like that, and it's nice to see their faces light up. -
Message 4
Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Friday, 4th December 2009
But you don't just get kind words, anyway. There's quite often useful, practical advice, and it can be a useful way of working through your thoughts on a problem, seeing what responses you get, and how you react to them - but also, there might be a possible way of dealing with whatever it is that you'd never even thought of.
I don't see what the problem with kind words is, anyway. As has been pointed out, some sort of support here is the only support some people are likely to get with some things. Just knowing, "it's not just me who's been through this," can really help, and knowing that other people got out the other side can mean a lot. -
Message 5
Posted by Thanks for all the fish (U10654037) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words do mean a great deal, especially from those who have no need to give them.
There does come a point IRL when they're not enough though; I am having to step back from a longstanding friendship with someone who would regularly tell me how much our friendship meant to him, how much he appreciated everything I did for him, etc etc, but it's turned out to be one way traffic. When things have gone rather pearshaped for me he has spouted the usual platitudes ('I'm sure you'll cope', kind of thing) then headed for the hills. Sadly this has happened with big problems and little so his words now ring rather hollow. -
Message 6
Posted by Judith Hearne (U7775397) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Burnt Apple, isn't "I'm sure you'll cope" the sort of thing people say when they don't know what to say? My special bugbear is being told "You'll be fine, you're such a survivor!".. Well yes, I keep right on breathing; but it would be nice to be able to do a bit more than just Survive.
Need kind words and suggestions for practical suggestions be mutually exclusive, though? I'm suspicious of the Practical Solutions brigade because they do tend to make out that they are. -
Message 7
Posted by AelM (U3803556) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I find it really difficult to put into writing anything that doesn't sound cliched, but always try to put /something/ on a thread if someone needs support. Having been in the situation before where just a few people saying "thinking of you" helped me, I'd hate someone who just needs a kind thought to feel ignored because people think kind words don't matter.
As for needing x number of kind words to cancel out cruel ones, that goes for deeds too - it only takes one person at work to ruin the whole day with an unkind comment no matter how much praise you get off others. -
Message 8
Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Friday, 4th December 2009
No, they're not.
And "I'm sure you'll cope" - well, experience shows that most of the time I do - I already know that. But that doesn't mean I don't appreciate some moral support along the way.
I wonder why it's called moral support? It's more about sympathy than morals. -
Message 9
Posted by That Old Janx Spirit (U2140966) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Yeah, just because you can help other people all the time, it doesn't mean you wouldn't like to have a few weak moments of your own in which someone else makes you a cup of tea for a change and says "there, there".
I've had boyfriends who have said "Oh, you're ill. I'll ring you again when you're better." 'had' is the operative word here... -
Message 10
Posted by Teletubby (U14241140) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I mentioned feeling sad about my height (or lack of it) on another thread.
The kind words that followed meant a lot to me.
I live alone and there are days when I don't speak to anyone. I'm not generally a miserable person but just sometimes there is a need to let one's feelings out, and it does help to get kind words, even if they are 'virtual'
So please don't stop offering a kind thought or two. -
Message 11
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I think the 'virtuality' (have I made up a new word?) is what makes it possible for us to be heartfelt in messages of sympathy and/or solutions. Not, I very hope, that I wouldn't want to offer kindness to RL friends, but there is always a lot of baggage there, and there is also the embarrassment of the face to face encounter.
I'm not putting this very well, so will give an example.
Right now the 12 year old son of one of my oldest and sweetest friends is dying, after a lifetime of fighting brain tumours. Somehow I find I simply cannot talk to my friend about this, though I did say when the latest diagnosis and prognosis was delivered that though I wouldn't be initiating any conversations I was most definitely here for her whenever she wants to talk to me herself. You who see my posts here know that my grief is genuine and rather despairing, but I'm failing miserably in the face to face RL situation. So, when I light candles here and I get a kind response from one of you it means the world. But it isn't helping my friend, so the guilt builds up.
I can find all sorts of excuses, like the age gap between my friend and me and the fact that I am childless. But I'm failing her. So inputs of courage here, as I have had, have helped me to pick up the phone.
Anyway, when I read on these boards of others in dreadful, heartbreaking situations my better self is able, after all, to offer the kindness I'm not able to offer my friend.
Hope some of that makes sense? -
Message 12
Posted by Mizze (U14226295) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words can mean everything
They can mean the difference between despair and sanity
Kind words can be a saviour
From someone who has both needed and received them recently
Mizze x -
Message 13
Posted by carrick-bend (U2288869) ** on Friday, 4th December 2009
Fri, 04 Dec 2009 14:23 GMT, in reply to IamMizze in message 12
Kind words can mean nothing, or they can be really positive and make a difference in someone's life.
Kindness can never be negative, I think, and the older I get, the more I value it. -
Message 14
Posted by Morganish (U9108847) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words can make all the difference. I have lost count of the number of times I've posted about difficulties large and small and the helpful, kind and sympathetic responses have been wonderful and helped me get a sense of proportion. This time last year my partner's father was dying in Ireland and I was driving up and down to London trying to care for my favourite elderly aunt who was also dying. The kindness and gentleness with which some of my panicky posts were greeted was reassuring and made a big difference.
I think any friend who gives you a 'You're strong, you'll cope' response before legging it isn't much of a friend. Even if you haven't the foggiest idea of what to say when someone's having a hard time, you can ask questions, listen and let them tell you in detail what the problem is. -
Message 15
Posted by Morganish (U9108847) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Carrick, I believe that when the Dalai Lama was asked what one thing each individual could do to help make the world a better place, he said: 'Be kind.'
-
Message 16
Posted by Nomadnomore - XNo - Quiz Queen (U3180380) on Friday, 4th December 2009
It makes perfect sense Smoctus.
Many years ago I had a friend whose daughter was terminally ill for seven months.I used to deliver the odd bowl of BBQd chicken legs, or a bag full of ready meals. She said later that they would have starved otherwise. Even just a cake might be welcome. -
Message 17
Posted by Thanks for all the fish (U10654037) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Smoctus, I know exactly what you mean. When my grandmother was diagnosed with cancer my mother moved in with her, taking unpaid leave from her job and leaving my father at home, several hundred miles away.
I found that whole period very difficult to cope with. I didn't think my grandmother deserved my mother putting her life on hold like that (she was a lousy mother and grandmother and would never in a million years have reciprocated had the situation been reversed). I was upset for my mother and what she was having to go through, the more so because I realised at the outset that my grandmother didn't want to survive what was a very treatable cancer, whereas my mother assumed til the penny finally dropped months later that she was going to be fine.
And I felt guilt, too, that I felt no more for my grandmother's predicament than I would have done had it been someone I barely knew. (That said, I did barely know her but you get my drift.)
So, I handled it badly. I was stressed and snappish and no fun to work or be with. My remedy for this was to withdraw from the situation. Rather than going to be with them every night, I visited once or twice a month at the most - and my grandmother only lived about half an hour away.
I'm sure had boards such as this been around then (early 90s)the inevitable kind words of other posters would have helped me find the courage to be a better daughter. Okay, so I was only in my early 20s and I hope I would do better now, but I still feel guilty nearly 20 years on. -
Message 18
Posted by tillytrolly (U8311312) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words are VERY important.
I've said before in ML that both Mr T & myself had always been the kind of people who felt that, when our parents died, we'd want this to be a private matter, would tell as few people as possible, & would feel horrified if people tried to express words of sympathy. When it did happen, we didn't shout it from the rooftops, but, naturally, a few people got to know & we were both amazed by how much a note or a few kind words from someone helped.
And it helps in so many ways....as DCM said, it gives you confidence, not just in the way she was talking about but in the feeling that you're not alone or a freak. And when that happens, you're much more able to see the wood for the trees & to move towards solutions, even if someone hasn't even suggested something (which they often do) I've been cheered up here so often when I've had health problems, simply by people being kind -
Message 19
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Thank you, XNo. I can do the practical stuff, though, it's just that I can't somehow say the heartfelt things I can say to all of you. I'm OK on the hugs, too.
Like I said, I'm somehow anonymous with all of you. It shouldn't make a difference but it does.
I'm with the Dalai Lama - in fact would turn that on its head and say the greatest sin is to be unkind.
But to wrench this back from the personal. It's strange what that elsethread poster wrote . Were they saying in effect Fine Words Butter No Parsnips, because I've always understood that to mean insincerity. We don't see that here in TVH, I don't think. As I read the messages they all seem to me to be full of concern and affection and a wish to help alter dreadful situations. -
Message 20
Posted by tillytrolly (U8311312) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Don't feel guilty, burnt apple....most people have been through some form of that., you know.
But, yes, somewhere like this & kind words help....someone you can let it out to & then take a deep breath & go back in again (&, if you don't want to "go public" here, you'll find friends offboard) -
Message 21
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Friday, 4th December 2009
burnt apple, please don't let that way-back-then guilt eat you up. We all wake up in the night in a cold sweat of guilt about something or other we have become a bit ashamed of. But as you say - you were only 20 and you felt your grandmother was taking unfair advantage of your mother to the detriment of the rest of the family.
So with hindsight you would offer more support to your mother. Wouldn't we all, in all sorts of everyday situations! I don't suppose your mother thought this was a capital offence, though, and neither must you now. Think of it as just a last gasp of terrible teenhood! -
Message 22
Posted by Claribel (U2264645) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Smoctus, I do understand what you're saying and in the kind of situation you describe it is really hard to know what to say.
I have always been rubbish at this. I think someone else (perhaps you) referred upthread to the awkwardness and embarrassment that goes with the heartfelt stuff when you do it face to face. I've been in a situation recently with one of my friends where I knew I had to say what I really felt (rather than just doing the jokey evasive stuff I normally get away with). Initially it was really really hard, and I was dodging the situation by doing it by text. Then one night when I'd had a bit of a tipple I wrote them a letter. It was a bit of a rambling letter and when I read it back in the morning, I decided I didn't want to send it, but I knew I did need to tell my friend something along the lines of what I'd written. So I screwed up my courage and said it (well, not all of it - it was quite a long letter!) - and although I felt hugely embarassed whilst I was doing it, I felt much *much* better because I'd said it.
I don't know if that helps. I think the letter route can work for some people - even if you don't send it, it can help get you ready to say something in person.
Oh, and in case it wasn't obvious from the above, I think kind words are pretty vital, actually. -
Message 23
Posted by superjan3 (U6523409) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I found these boards very helpful when my Dad died last year. It didn't replace real life help, but complimented it.
Kind words can help, but they can't replace RL assistance. Often when it is most difficult to ask for help, that is the time when you most need to do so.
J -
Message 24
Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I agree they don't replace RL assistance, but I think what triggered the original post was that some people think they therefore have no value, and that's the bit I don't agree with.
-
Message 25
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Friday, 4th December 2009
You are all proving something that I said earlier, that ML sympathy very often helps to screw up flagging courage.
I now know exactly what I must do - what I want to do but am just being 'terribly British' about. I must/want to go and hug my friend and tell her I love her, grieve for her grief and will always be by her side as she goes through this heartbreaking time. There isn't anything else, is there, but I think I believed there must be something I was missing and needed to pull out of a hat.
Thank you! -
Message 26
Posted by Sister Primrose of the Red Tinsel Flag (U5405579) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Yes, kind words matter very much. For the most part I am quite an optomistic person and confident in my ability to just get on with it. Sometimes that confidence, if not actually wavering, is strained. At the moment I'm facing redundancy, my daughter is due hip surgery and will need supporting through that and my Dad has to have minor surgery for some growths that probably are a result of a cancer he was operated on for last year. I am feeling the strain, and kind words have definitely helped me take a deep breath and get on with it.
On the not-knowing-how-to-talk-about-a-terminally-ill-child front, how about starting with 'What you and X are going through is so terrible and bloody and unfair and awful that I feel at a loss for what to say and do. Anything I can do to help I will. Just ask...'
PP -
Message 27
Posted by Hazel Wooley (U2338026) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words are every bit as important, more so in fact, than the 'stiff upper lip' approach. It is encouraging to hear kindness and empathy when we're going through hard and trying times. And, until we've been on the receiving end, it's hard to understand just how comforting this place can be.
HW - the grateful recipient of kind words and encouraging advice from ML and forever in its debt. -
Message 28
Posted by Prof Pepita in Wonderland (U3101721) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Yes- completely agree with those who have stressed how important and beneficial kind words can be, whether on here or elsewhere.
And for many of us (judging by people's responses on here) , if we've posted/talked of problems or sadnesses in our lives, certainly far more helpful than either less kind/sympathetic words or silence could ever be. -
Message 29
Posted by captainbenayoun (U13326760) on Friday, 4th December 2009
A view from some one who has (indeed still is having) kind words from ML. My experience is that there are things that I cannot say to my loved ones because they are scary and/or angry. I have found ML an invaluable place to express the fear and hurt that I do not want to express to my RL dear ones. I have found nothing but kindness and understanding here. I treasure that
Thank you
Cap -
Message 30
Posted by sagethyme (U5272261) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Another here who found it hard to discuss problems with RL friends whether my problems or theirs.
I am getting better at both in recent years, since an impulse made me visit a friend who had just suffered a family tragedy.
Afterwards I felt almost guilty at how grateful she was for the small things I was able to do and say, if that doesn't sound silly.
In ML kind words may seem small to the giver but are so obviously appreciated by the recipients. I have found inspiration and practical ideas here and that lovely thing, the kindness of strangers. -
Message 31
Posted by La Min gibbon swinging strumpet draped in black (U12534030) on Friday, 4th December 2009
The kindness of strangers, where does that come from?
I don't think I am very good at it, and sometimes see other people posting with much more sensitivity than my clod hopping efforts. But I figure that if one tiny bit of my witterings means something to one person who might read it, then it is worth it. There is sometimes a need to be bracing, but one can try to be kindly bracing. I have had some lovely things said to me and I have treasured them, it is always wonderful to find that you aren't completely out of step, or losing your judgement or your marbles, or a monster. It's a great sounding board for things that I can type but maybe not say.
Often all I can do is tell people I am thinking of them, but when I say that on here it means I really have been, I find myself unable to just utter hollow words, and I hope that it works both ways. I think it does, if someone takes the trouble to be kind, it would surely be because they mean it. Ok I can think of exceptions, but they are exceptions. -
Message 32
Posted by Teletubby (U14241140) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I think in real life, as many have mentioned the difficulty of knowing what to say, it might help to have some words ready in your head to meet the situation.
For instance, my long time neighbour has just died, and I saw his widow today. I found it was fairly easy to speak of her husband by telling her what a gentleman he had always been, and how hard he had fought a long battle with cancer and repeated infections. Also I said how hard it had been for her too, and she must take care of herself now.
I am the sort of person that gets a bit tongue-tied which is why I gave it some thought in advance. -
Message 33
Posted by Lili Bolero and the band played on (U10534540) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I suspect that many of us are more articulate on MBs than in RL situations - I certainly am.
What I have gained from 'kind words' on these Boards is a huge amount. Brought up in a small, stiff, formal family, which had a whole List of Things We Do Not Discuss, I feel privileged to be able to listen to the experiences and wise counsel of so many other people. -
Message 34
Posted by Sunny Clouds (U7606212) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Kind words online can make a big difference to me.
One of the nice things about coming here is that no one is obliged to reply, so you're not imposing on anyone by posting. If I feel awful and keep phoning my RL friends, they don't have the energy for all of it, whereas here there's a large pool of people that can read what I've written and offer kind words.
Kind words, that is, that have helped me immeasurably over the years. For me, recovery from severe mental illness has been a long and painful journey that hasn't finished, and kind words can all too often make the difference between giving up and carrying on. -
Message 35
Posted by sweet-rocket (U11357111) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:09 GMT, in reply to Judith Hearne in message 1
Not quite getting this - if a person feels in need of kind words and makes a post inviting said words on this board then that's what will usually happen. I don't see the issue. Win/win.
Advice is another matter. That can be a bit more problematic. -
Message 36
Posted by Prof Pepita in Wonderland (U3101721) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I have found people saying nothing in such situations in RL very hurtful/disappointing. My dad died last year, and I'd told my neighbour he was in Intensive Care and explained why I kept flying off on my own leaving my children at home with OH.But she never asked me about him again. She either just wasn't interested and had forgotten all about what I'd told her, or she was too embarrassed to mention it. But I was disapppointed by her saying nothing, not enquiring how things were going etc.
Whereas my other neighbour (also a woman of about my own age with children like me etc.) made a point of speaking to me and saying she was sorry to hear that my dad had died. (She'd asked OH about it and knew what had happened.) That meant something to me, and gave me some comfort- and whether wrongly or rightly, I think more highly of (and warmly towards)the neighbour who spoke to me and made the effort, however difficult/delicate such conversation may be, than the one who never mentioned the subject again.
(The neighbour who spoke up is a far shyer, quieter person than the one who said nothing, so it wasn't a matter of that..) -
Message 37
Posted by savannahlady (U2362903) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Fri, 04 Dec 2009 20:20 GMT, in reply to SmoctusMole in message 19
I'm with the Dalai Lama - in fact would turn that on its head and say the greatest sin is to be unkind.Â
Indeed Mole - I would agree with both views. Kindness costs nothing and one never knows what one might have achieved by offering a few kind words at a particular time in someone else's life. Sometimes when people are in real despair, the kindness of a stranger who takes the time to listen and to offer compassion and encouragement, can quite literally mean the difference between life and death.
Like many people here, I have had occasion to be grateful for the kindness of strangers - which I believe is particularly potent - and I hope that I have also given it back to others when I see it is needed. I am not exaggerating when I say that to me, kindness is really the essence of life and without it, we are little more than automatons. Without wishing to sound trite or twee, I see kindness as love personified and it differentiates us from most animals.
Savvie -
Message 38
Posted by Prof Pepita in Wonderland (U3101721) on Friday, 4th December 2009
I suppose it indicates empathy, or an effort at such, if sincere- and that is one of the distinguishing features of mankind, isn't it, the capacity for empathy?
-
Message 39
Posted by goldilocks exits pursued by bears (U1859740) on Friday, 4th December 2009
In reply to Pepita in Wonderland in message 38
I am often in the position that no words will suffice for how I feel, so I post no words, because I do not trust myself to express what I really feel. -
Message 40
Posted by Judith Hearne (U7775397) on Friday, 4th December 2009
Sunny, your point about not wanting to impose on your RL friends is one I meant to make in my OP. I have very few friends in RL (well, hey, all I do is moan...) and I live in fear of alienating them by inflicting my lonely-old-spinster woes on them. Which means kind words on MBs are all the more valued.
I've been very interested by the comments about how awkward and embarrassing it is for some (most?) of us to express compassion in RL. I really do think that there are those who adopt that "Words mean nothing, practical solutions and deeds are all" stance from a feeling of guilt or inadequacy. It can be very harsh, when you can perfectly well see all the possible solutions for yourself and have done from the word Go.. But are longing for a word of encouragement. -
Message 41
Posted by greensparklybejewelledone (U2283175) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
Sat, 05 Dec 2009 00:36 GMT, in reply to Primrose Path in message 26
On the not-knowing-how-to-talk-about-a-terminally-ill-child front, how about starting with 'What you and X are going through is so terrible and bloody and unfair and awful that I feel at a loss for what to say and do. Anything I can do to help I will. Just ask...'Â
Just to add to that - when a friend of mine had a terminally-ill husband she told me that the best thing, practically speaking, was not so much when people said 'just ask' (which was well meant but often not taken up on). She said it was fantastic when people offered specific help, such as 'I could do your shopping', or 'I could collect people/do a hospital run,/do some laundry/cook a meal/whatever'... things like that, because it meant that she didn't have to organise it and think 'who can I ask to do what?' but rather, all she had to do was say 'yes please, that would be terrific'.
I completely agree that kind words matter hugely. I know how much they mean to me, and people have told me how important they have been when I've said them, both virtually and in RL.
gj
x -
Message 42
Posted by groovymy3("didn't catpee~not nuffin, not no how") (U14178645) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
Judith Hearne her is you're
I have one name that sprung to mind who made tha comment, not sure if I should try and find it to prove myself right. -
Message 43
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
You are so right, greensparklyjewel, and it just goes to show we should never be shy about making practical offers of help. There are occasions, though, when there really isn't any obvious need for practical help or when it would be intrusive. So RL can be ridden with additional difficulties!
But I think another huge benefit of ML is that writing it all down gives us the opportunity to clarify our thoughts and sort out what would be for the best. -
Message 44
Posted by Sunny Clouds (U7606212) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
A few years ago, my closest friend at the time knew that she was dying. Her GP didn't believe her. She had stopped being able to cope with housework and then I persuaded her to let me sort out the house for her. I seized twenty washer-loads of laundry and took it home to do. I scrubbed her kitchen. I bought some bits and pieces. I helped her to move things around to give her two sons separate bedrooms. I cleaned up her sitting room.
Shortly after, she died. She had been right and the doctors had been wrong.
Whilst she was dying, I took her sons to their granny at the other end of the country and looked after granny after she brought them back and their father told them their mother was dead.
I am glad that she could die knowing that her house and sons had been sorted out.
Sadly it didn't last because their father turned to drink and drugs and social services had to become involved, but she never saw that. -
Message 45
Posted by happyjazzbaby-no longer funny (U14072874) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
I lurk on these threads more than I post, mainly because I'm not very good at small talk and sometimes feel my thoughts might be seen as intrusive when the other posters obviously "Speak" regularly. And I have said this on another thread.
But there are many who post here whose stories and troubles have reduced me to sympathetic tears.
I am the same in RL. The only son of my best friend died on Boxing Day last year from an alcohol related illness. He was 44.
I knew she wouldn't be doing much celebrating this year so yesterday we had a nice lunch and a wander round the shops. We don't see each other that often as age, finance and distance are all problems for us.
We talked about everything except Christmas and it's ramifications but when we parted there were extra long hugs and I know she knew what I was thinking but couldn't say.
I cried for her when I got home.
People who know me know I care but on here, I just can't find the words. -
Message 46
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
That is such an inspiring story, Sunny Clouds. How wonderful that you were able to see the positive things you could do to help your friend and her family.
You say "sadly it couldn't last" because of your friend's husband later turning to drink and then all the subsequent Social Services involvement. But I think the part of the story where you were actively involved must have made a very great difference to your friend's sons so they had a pattern to build on.
Lots of people have been saying no act or word of kindness is ever wasted, and I am sure this is true. -
Message 47
Posted by greensparklybejewelledone (U2283175) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
Sat, 05 Dec 2009 01:21 GMT, in reply to SmoctusMole in message 43
There are occasions, though, when there really isn't any obvious need for practical help or when it would be intrusive. So RL can be ridden with additional difficulties!
But I think another huge benefit of ML is that writing it all down gives us the opportunity to clarify our thoughts and sort out what would be for the best.Â
That's all true. The one thing that seems fairly constant is that kind words really do have a value, even if we express them badly (as I all-too-often do!).
gj
x -
Message 48
Posted by Prof Pepita in Wonderland (U3101721) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
I certainly don't believe anyone can see lack of sympathetic words on the board as necessarily indicating lack of empathy.
The OP asked if this idea that kind words on the board are of no use, carried weight- I agree with most people that it doesn't.
But I'm definitely not about to start inferring lack of empathy/sympathy from lack of postings.As people have said, some people find it hard to find the 'right words', even in print and at a distance, on such occasions. -
Message 49
Posted by SmoctusMole (U13882662) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
happy jb
You did just find the words!
And incidentally I also have up to now only lurked in TVH apart from lighting candles and leaving a msg on other other thread.
Haven't our life experiences all been so very similar. Different in detail, but otherwise we've experienced lots of the same things. And I think that for me at least I've been encouraged a lot today and see more clearly what I should be doing next. -
Message 50
Posted by Judith Hearne (U7775397) on Saturday, 5th December 2009
Oh Lud, SC and HappyJazzB, what very, very sad tales. And yes, I do wish I could wave a wand and make your friends' pain go away...Really, does it help to say.. I care?
gj, I understand you point about appreciating it when friends just turned up with soup, etc etc... And here's where I confess, I would love to do such like, because I would dearly love to be the helper, rather than the helpee.
But I wouldn't dare... I mean, I can't cook, and who would like *my* soup..? Who would trust ME to collect their shopping or drive them to the hospital..?? No-one.
At which point I'm forced to admit that it takes confidence, as well as guts, to offer practical help to those in need.
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