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Posted by Leaping Badger (U3587940) on Monday, 12th April 2010
The county season has just started, and the international summer is approaching. Here's a thread to discuss the domestic game and other cricket matters. We'll probably start separate threads for the England test series this summer.
I heart cricket.
'Ö'
, in reply to message 1.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Bookmarking
I heart cricket too.
, in reply to message 1.
Posted by Lady Trudie Tilney Glorfindel Maldini (U2222312) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I heart cricket too, Leaps, but still pine for the rythm of the old cricket season when you knew when & where each test match would be!
As far as I can tell, England have lengthy one-days series against Aus then Bangladesh, then 4 tests against Pakistan crammed into August, then more T20s and ODIs against Pakistan. Is this right - England only have 4 home tests this year, or have I missed some out somewhere?
, in reply to message 3.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I think thetre are six England Tests this summer: four against Pakistan and two against Bangladesh.
Plus there are a couple of Pakistan v Australia Tests.
We are one England Test lite though, for some reason. We usually get seven Tests a summer.
Why have the ECB crammed four test matches against Pakistan into one month?
And they wonder why our bowlers always go down with injuries?
And as someone mentioned the other day, only the ECB could re-organise the county structure by cutting one competition and teams still end up playing more days cricket.
Seven is quite a recent phenomenon.
A major series of five, or two otehr (patronising) of three each was the usual pattern until quite recently.
I'm going to three at Lord's, E v BD, E v Pak, Pak v Aus. One day of each only.
, in reply to message 6.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Seven is quite a recent phenomenon. Â
Indeed.
It used to be five in the winter and six in the summer - and not nearly as many ODIs!
But since we've started getting two touring teams a year (which I like) they upped it to seven in the summer, and six in the winter. Unless one of those teams is Bangladesh, who don't seem to deserve a three Test series ...
I thought the contract with Sky was for seven tests a summer?
Well done to Matthew Hoggard for winning his first game as Leicestershire captain this morning.
Looks like Hampshire will have to be happy with a draw
It has been, although it was renewed last year, so perhaps it has been changed. I know ECB were starting to respond to the accusations that there was too much cricket being played. Mind you, the summer looks fairly packed with fairly meaningless matches, and the schedule looks particularly barmy this summer.
Like Erms, I hanker after the old rhythms when you knew where you were and it felt natural, and there was a huge build-up to the one test series of the summer.
Personally, I quite like the idea of having two divisions of 5 test teams, although it would be difficult to know how to preserve such series as Eng v Aus, India v Pakistan etc if this were implemented. But ten international teams is too many to play each other regularly if there are tests and ODIs (and especially with T20 added to the mix too). Any thoughts?
I'm hoping the weather holds out for this weekend as I'm planning to go to watch Sussex v Surrey on Saturday. Erms, let me know if you and Lambers plan a Hampshire trip this summer.
'Ö'
, in reply to message 10.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I don't like the idea of splitting the existing ten Test teams into two tiers. Although I do think there should be a second tier of Test teams that include Kenya, Ireland and the like so that full-blown Test cricket is not such a shock to the system when they graduate!
I think ten teams can be accommodated fairly easily into the schedules, even allowing for the fact Pakistan technically have no "home" games at the moment.
What I don't understand is why we have to have a Twenty20 International Tournament every year, and so many ODIs. Get rid of some of that clutter and there will be plenty of room for Tests.
, in reply to message 11.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I must admit, I do feel sorry for teams like New Zealand, and even nowadays, the West Indies who always get lumbered with two tests in a series.
The New Zealand board even had to cut their recent test series with Australia down to two tests from three, because of the IPL and the forthcoming World T20.
I think all test series should consist of a minimum of three tests, but the money men will never let that happen as they want to fill the schedule up with limited overs games which bring in more revenue.
It doesn't seem right that teams like England and Australia end up playing 14 or 16 tests in a year, when teams like Sri Lanka and New Zealand are lucky to play 7 or 8 in a year.
And I agree with c-A-A, why is there yet enough World T20, less than a year after the previous one?
, in reply to message 12.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I didn't realise there was such a discrepancy between the amount of Tests each country played. Surely that skews the Test rankings somewhat?
I'm particularly upset that Sri Lanka and New Zealand are so short-changed, as these are two of my favourite sides.
I completely agree about minimum three Test series, any fewer is hardly worthwhile.
Sangakkara said in an interview recently (probably one you linked to, SB) that there should be more showcase Test series like the Ashes. I have no idea how this would be achieved, but I do feel Test series should be the centrepiece of the cricket calendar.
, in reply to message 13.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Well I was a bit bored at lunchtime and with the help of the internet, I have put together a list of tests played by each nation since October 2008.
This isn't particularly scientific and my mental arithmetic may have let me down but here goes!
The number of tests played by each nation since October 2008 -
Australia - 25
England - 20
New Zealand - 17
India - 16
West Indies and South Africa - 14
Bangladesh - 13
Sri Lanka - 12
Pakistan - 11
, in reply to message 14.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Actually it probably gives a clearer picture, if you go from May 2008 -
Australia - 28
England - 27
New Zealand - 20
India - 19
South Africa - 18
West Indies - 17
Sri Lanka - 15
Bangladesh - 13
Pakistan - 11
, in reply to message 15.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Sri Lanka have played just over half what the Aussies have! That seems odd and wrong to me.
Do the likes of Sri Lanka, New Zealand, Bangladesh, India and Pakistan ever play five Test series?
This how the ratings are worked out.
I don't pretend to understand all of it, but it does seem from a quick look-through that the number of patches played WOULD affect a team's overall rating.
, in reply to message 16.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Monday, 12th April 2010
The only series across that period that consisted of five matches was last year's Ashes series.
The West Indies v England series in the West Indies was officially five matches in the end, but only because the infamous second test was declared a draw because of the dodgy outfield and they added another test in Antigua.
, in reply to message 17.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
It doesn't take a genius to see how the ICC prioritises formats of the game, does it?
The fact that a series only has to consist of two Tests to be viable for those rankings says it all.
I meant matches not patches in my above post, btw
, in reply to message 10.
Posted by Lady Trudie Tilney Glorfindel Maldini (U2222312) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Will do, Leapers, maybe it'll actually happen this year!
I must be looking back through rose-tinted specs, but didn't we used to have a 5 or 6 test series every summer? It seems only Australia are 'worth' a full series these days.
, in reply to message 19.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Monday, 12th April 2010
I definitely remember five and six Test series against South Africa and West Indies. Never against India, Sri Lanka, New Zealand or Pakistan, though.
, in reply to message 20.
Posted by SussexCornflower InTheFinalCountdown (U13833966) on Monday, 12th April 2010
Just bookmarking the new thread.
, in reply to message 21.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
Four of the Five Wisden Cricketers of the Year are Swann, Onions, Broad and Prior. The fifth being Michael Clarke.
I do like their World Eleven
, in reply to message 22.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
Hmmm! Not so sure about those selections.
You can't argue against Swann being one of them, but if somebody asked me to name my five cricketers of the year, the other four probably wouldn't feature.
I would probably swap Watson for Clarke, for starters.
I see KP has been having his say again, I agree with him to an extent as playing against and with the best players in the world can only improve players -
, in reply to message 23.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
I think I'd definitely have Clarke - he played a blinder.
The thing with those Five Players is that you can only feature once, otherwise I think Strauss would have been in there.
I guess it makes sense for England players to try and get as much Twenty20 experience as possible before a major tournament, but I don't think the bowlers will suffer from NOT going to IPL. And I like the fact they deliberately chose to focus on Tests rather than going for the big bucks.
, in reply to message 24.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
I didn't realise that you could only be chosen as one of the five players once. That bit of detail certainly explains that list!
, in reply to message 25.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
The thing I always forget is that the Five are judged on their impact on the previous season of English cricket. I'm always surprised by how many England players there are as opposed to other nations!
, in reply to message 26.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
A very refreshing to read and concise article about the state of the English game -
Good to see someone sticking up for county cricket!
, in reply to message 27.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
I completely agree that we need County cricket. Test cricket is THE best form of the game, the most pure form of the game, the stage where players and countries show who's best. Players can only prepare for Test cricket at County level. They can't do it by playing endless forgettable rounds of Twenty20 matches.
I do wonder if eighteen Counties is too many. But they seem to be serving the Test team OK for now.
It's going to take a master of diplomacy and financial wizard to reconcile the integrity of cricket with the entertainment factor and the big bucks.
How many of us will be playing regular cricket this season?
My mob start on 25th April, hoping to improve on last season's bottom place in the bottom of 6 divisions. The bottom division is often quite tough, as that's where the new clubs get put - spend a season thrashing the likes of us round the park before getting fast-tracked to division 2.
As for watching I have tickets for The Oval England v Pakistan day 3, and I have committed to watching Marcus Trescothick bat sometime this summer. Realised that I have never seen him score a run with my actual eyes (one time I saw Marcus bat he was in his teens and was worked over for a duck by Javagal Srinath in a B&H; only ever seen him field for England).
My radical idea for improving the game is to allow any amount of ball-tampering, so long as no tools or additives are used. No bottle-tops or sunblock, but yes to fingernails, teeth, sweat and grubbing the ball on the ground. Would give these pampered, helmeted, thick blade flat track bully Test batsmen something to think about & even up the contest between bat and ball.
I think the finest cricketer of my era has been Allan Border. Can expand on reasons should anyone be interested....
peace
DrDx
, in reply to message 29.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
Yep - go for it. I'm intrigued about Allan Border (being a big fan of his successor).
I've heard the argument for allowing ball tampering before. Can't remember why it was shot down, except that I guess NO tampering is easier to police than some "legitimate" tampering. I would introduce the Duke worldwide - the Kookaburra just gets too soft too quickly.
okay - Border had a batting average of 50 when he finished. He got that average without any soft 'Zimbangla' runs, against truly great bowlers - from Holding to Ambrose, from Imran to Waqar & Wasim etc etc. Awesome career performance. He only once bagged a pair, but the second duck was in the middle of Curtley's 7 wickets for 1 run after Dean Jones complained about his armbands.
Border took over as skipper of Oz when their side had been ripped apart by rebel tour shenanigins, and he developed that team into the first generation of the Australian Invincibles that plague us till today. I believe he has the record for the most consecutive test matches played (don't think he missed one whilst skipper and I'm pretty sure he was never dropped once first selected)...
I'm on a bit of a mission about this, because whenever great batsmen are discussed AB is never mentioned - despite an incredible record. I suppose because he was a gritty and dour player. And the journey he led that Australian team on is amazing....
top cricketer innit!
peace
DrDx
, in reply to message 31.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
You make a good case.
I know he featured in those programmes during last year's Ashes, and David Gower mentioned that AB made the deliberate decision not to "fraternise with the enemy", and did not socialise with the opposition after matches or series - needless to say, Australia won the Ashes that year!
One of the reasons I admire Mark Taylor is because he took AB's sledging, uncompromising style and added a bit of gentlemaness to it.
Didn't Mark Taylor declare on himself to preserve a Bradman record?
You'd let the umpires police the ball-tampering. If they thought it had gone too far they'd offer the batsmen a selection of replacements to choose from.
peace
DrDx
, in reply to message 33.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Wednesday, 14th April 2010
Wouldn't surprise me I remember he dropped himself from the ODI team because of poor form.
Because the players could alter the state of the ball, the ball itself could not really be proof of ball-tampering - as it is now. Which would mean the umpires would have to police hidden tools (rings, wristbands, studs, stuff in the mouth etc) - this could be tricky.
, in reply to message 30.
Posted by The Saturday Boy (U5956760) on Thursday, 15th April 2010
I've always thought they should use the same make of ball for all tests. Sadly, if they were to use a ball worldwide, it would probably be the Kookaburra as the Duke ball is currently only used in the UK.
Bizarrely, the Duke ball is only used in the 1st division of the County Championship and another maker of ball is used in the 2nd division.
The greater powers in cricket also have to look at the pitches that are being prepared for test matches now. They are increasingly favouring bat over ball (especially in the sub-continent) and resulting in dull draws and crowds suffer as a result.
, in reply to message 29.
Posted by Leaping Badger (U3587940) on Thursday, 15th April 2010
Hi Daeve, good to see you.
Good point about Trescothick. I think I'll make an effort to see him this season too. I have a few duds like yours: I saw Brian Lara play for Warwickshire v Surrey in 1995 (out for 4) and Tendulkar at the Oval in the 2007 series (survived 11 balls).
I've noticed that a lot of the championship matches are being played Monday-Thursday this season. That's really cross-making. It seems that even the administrators don't care about the long form of the game now.
'Ö'
nice one LB!
My worst 'dud' was Inzamam-ul-Haq, out second ball in a World Cup (99) game against Windies....had flown from Glasgow to Bristol to watch him bat!
that's cricket....
peace
DrDx
, in reply to message 37.
Posted by Leaping Badger (U3587940) on Thursday, 15th April 2010
Oh bad luck. My best Inzy moment was when he refused to even come back out on to the field after the Darrell Hair 5-run-fine fiasco at the Oval a few years ago.
Mind you, last summer Reggie travelled from all the way from Dundee to Chester-le-Street and play was rained off. That's a bugger.
'Ö'
Doctor
I'm dying to play again - after a knee injury, necessitating surgery and only playing half of last season, I am raring to go and nets have gone very well.
We have friendlies on Sunday 18th, Sat 24th, Sun 25th, before the league kicks off on 1 May.
Green pitches, humidity, lovely..... hopefully I'll get my wickets in the bank early season if/before it (a big 'if') gets hot and dry.
Have tickets for Lord's tests, all of 'em.
SM
Doctor
Funny you mention Srinath, as I reckon he was a massively under-rated bowler, a master craftsman, and with Prasad gave India a cutting edge, unusual for them at the time.
I may slope off to Lord's this afternoon to watch the final session.
Hope those who actually play cricket as opposed to just watching it will post here about their experiences.
Heard this morning that Surrey are hoping to sign Brian Lara. Sadly not in time for their game against Sussex at the moment, which I'm planning to go to tomorrow, but I might get to see him score another couple of runs at some point.
'Ö'
No more playing for me sadly. Found out recently that the pain I've been in for ages is arthritis in my right hip. But I plan to do more teas for our town team. And possibly to find the time to go and see a few county matches, which I haven't for ages.
Feeling browned off at Northants (my local County) for letting Monty go off to Sussex. They let Graeme Swann go a few years back and look how that turned out. But they say they are looking for some silverware this year - who knows - this might be the lucky year.
, in reply to message 42.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Friday, 16th April 2010
Sorry to hear you can't play any more, Compassrose
From what I've read I don't think Swann was very happy at all at Northants. He was thinking of packing cricket in completely. So your county did England a HUGE favour by letting him go to Notts!
Yes, cricket-Angel Alpert, you are right.
But this happens a lot at Northants. It happened with Mal Loye - who I now see has gone back to Northants so something must have changed. It has been very frustrating watching talented young players get fed up and move on.
I don't think they've ever quite got the balance right in the management, captaincy and coaching at Northants - maybe that's improving now. They've also always had a bit of a chip on their shoulders believing that the England selectors never ever came to see their players. I think that's gone too since Monty got picked, but there's always been a feeling for me that the leadership wasn't sorted.
Ah well, onwards and upwards.
, in reply to message 44.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Friday, 16th April 2010
Sounds like things might be heading in the right direction if Mal Loye has returned.
There do seem to be some "unfashionable" Counties - but this does change, and I'm sure Nothants' fortunes will be on the up and up soon.
I went to Northants during the 1999 World Cup to see South Africa play Sri Lanka. It seemed a nice Ground to me - though I guess it might have changed a bit in - blimey! - eleven years!
Ooh - I was at that match too. And I went to see the Bangladesh/Pakistan match as well when the tigers mashed the Pakistanis and the whole place went wild. (In fact as I recall someone had to be ejected for letting off fireworks in the temporary stands.) There was a bit of a question-mark over the result afterwards as I recall, as it was a bit 'sus' that Bangladesh was hankering after Test status at the time, which of course they subsequently got. But it was a fantastic day.
Northants IS a nice ground and a very nice pitch too. The food has always been awful though.
, in reply to message 46.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Friday, 16th April 2010
If beating Pakistan in ODI is the qualfication of obtaining Test status, Ireland are overdue!
As an aside, we SHOULD have fireworks at cricket - maybe just ODIs and Twenty20. Though not in the crowd - that would just lead to chaos and probably carnage! I've been watching the IPL, and after EVERY game - no matter who wins - tons of official fireworks are let off. It's a bit OTT, but then so's the IPL!
Oh lor' - I've tried watching the IPL and I just can't see the wood for the trees. I'm afraid I'm a bit of an old buffer, cricket-Angel. I also can't stand the noise at ODIs and and I've never been to a T20 match because I can only imagine it would be worse...
, in reply to message 48.
Posted by cricket-Angel Tucker (U3382697) on Friday, 16th April 2010
That's the great thing about cricket, Compassrose - there's something for everyone!
And it's why no one format should really be promoted above the others.
, in reply to message 49.
Posted by Lady Trudie Tilney Glorfindel Maldini (U2222312) on Friday, 16th April 2010
Anyone see Graham Onions on Question of Sport just now?
Good job he can bowl well, really.
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