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Teenage pregnancy
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Message 1.Â
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Sunday, 27th June 2010
Sun, 27 Jun 2010 19:15 GMT
Hello - I am a semi-regular poster on these boards, but have adopted a new identity for this sensitive question.
A friend of mine (yes, really - it's not me) has a 17 year-old son who has recently admitted to his parents that his girlfriend (same age) is pregnant with his child. This has come as a complete bolt from the blue for the parents. I'm pretty sure that they didn't think that he was sexually active - both the families come from religious backgrounds. Both teenagers are bright and academic, with university and professional career aspirations. There is no question of a termination.
My friend and her husband, whilst reeling from the news, want to support the teenagers as best they can, but are really struggling as how best to do this. This is compounded as my friend's son seems to be at least to some extent in denial about the whole situation. He says that he loves his girlfriend, but certainly doesn't want to get married yet. Apparently he is talking about the future with no reference to how the baby will fit in - he doesn't see why it might affect what happens re going to university either for him or his girlfriend. He seems to have no concept that this is a life-changing situation. He hasn't talked at all about practical or financial matters.
I just wonder whether there are any MLers with any experience of this kind of situation. In one way, I can see that a 17 year-old lad simply doesn't have enough life experience to grasp how major this is, whereas his parents can see the ramifications much more clearly. My friend and her husband (and the other parents) are not going to leave the young people to sink or swim on their own, and so perhaps they are helping to cushion the realities that otherwise they would have to deal with. But my friend feels very frustrated that her son seems just to be ignoring the reality of the situation, talking blithely about organising an 18th birthday party etc as if everything should just go on as before. Is the penny likely to drop at any stage? Your experiences would be much appreciated. -
Message 2
Posted by Looby-Lewis (U11820972) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
No personal exeperience, but a mate of mine has found her boy in a similar circumstance. She's embraced it, including being a 'young' nan.
Friend's boy was the girls regular BF and they now have a place together.
I probably can't help as the lad and his girl are prepared to bring up the child well, and lots of us have provided or offered bits for the the house.
They have acknowledged their responsibilities though. Youngsters can be more mature than you think sometimes (as long as you ignore Pip in DtA). -
Message 3
Posted by Christina Rossetti (U3929588) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
Thu, 01 Jul 2010 22:41 GMT, in reply to wisdomneeded in message 1
Your friend's son will come round as the pregnancy develops. And certainly will when the baby arrives, as long as he sticks by his girlfriend. If he doesn't, at least his and her parents will be around to help her. That's a lot more than a lot of people have. I don't see why he shouldn't be planning his 18th, it will probably be the last chance he gets to have some fun in a long time. -
Message 4
Posted by Christina Rossetti (U3929588) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
Thu, 01 Jul 2010 22:48 GMT, in reply to Christina Rossetti in message 3
Sorry, meant to add that I appreciate it must be difficult and worrying for your friends, but, it sounds as though they are doing everything they can. The lad and his gf can't know what it'll be like until it happens (none of us do, no matter how many books we read). When the baby comes along everything will change and I expect he'll grow up a lot. All the parents can do is offer support, which they are already doing. He'll appreciate it when the baby comes, I'm sure. -
Message 5
Posted by Sunny Clouds (U14258963) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
Just a thought - if bf doesn't want to be actively involved in bringing up baby and expects gf to get on with it, then if bf's parents are actively involved, it at least means that baby isn't out of sight and out of mind. If he comes home to find baby gurgling in a cot for the evening or whatever, it will mean he can't ignore it completely.
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Message 6
Posted by MV Whitby May Rose (U6862284) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
It must be very hard for the paternal grandparents in a situation like this. I wish everyone well.
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Message 7
Posted by Kris massblues (U14058894) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
Hi, sorry..no personal experience but I just wanted to say that perhaps the young father to be could be taught the ramifications of what will certainly be a life-changing experience for the girl by ensuring that his responsibility starts with the financial.
I am so tough on this: from the moment they hit puberty i made my boys aware that should they have unprotected sex that resulted in a pregnancy they would have to accept that their life would change as well as the one who was pregant. They knew that i would ensure that any and all none essential monies they earned (including generous allowance from their father) would be used to support the child.
My youngest son did actually ring me one night a few months before his 18th birthday to tell me that the condom he had been using had split and what should they do...the following morning I chatted to my son about this and told him that he had been lucky because, had his girlfriend become pregnant, he would not have had his planned 18th b'day party, and neither would we support him through university (though would certainly not have stopped him going per se), as the money would have been needed to fulfil his parental obligations.
He protested that he had fulfilled his responsibilty by using a condom but actually that wasn't the point and i told him this. The point would not to have punished him, but to have him support a child that he had helped bring into this world. And to be fair, once explained, he did understand this.
Sorry, but this 17 year old is still a child in his parents eyes (and of course he is, they bioth are bless them), but like his girlfriend he unfortunately now has to grow up quickly and take responsibilty.
I wish both the young ones and their parents a happy and life-enhancing journey into this next stage of their lives.
kris -
Message 8
Posted by sweetFeet (U14377598) on Thursday, 1st July 2010
I was a teenage mum.
Though the father wasn't in his teens.
I thought I was invincible and couldn't understand the fuss. I was also a student as was the father.
It worked out. God knows how but it did.
I'm sure your friends son, and his gf, will find their way through this.they almost certainly will. -
Message 9
Posted by bolshy (U7233633) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Gulp.
Apologies in advance for raising this & I really don't want to turn this into a pro/anti abortion thread but this sentence keeps leaping out at the every time I read your opening post:
There is no question of a termination.Â
Deep breath. Is this the parents speaking? Has the girl even had the opportunity to consider *all* her options?
Gawd. Sorry if this is crashingly insensitive but .... oh I'll shut up now.
Sorry everyone. xx -
Message 10
Posted by sweetFeet (U14377598) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
It's a very valid question Bolsh. The OP says that the family is very religious, maybe it's a done deal that abortion can never be an option.
It wouldn't have been an option in mine either but then, neither would sex before marriage.
I am a very, very black sheep. Ewe maybe.
Slumps on desk. -
Message 11
Posted by catwomyn (U1485618) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
It's OK, I had the same thought BP.
Then I had another thought. If the teens are both in education there should be a welfare adviser available to talk to them - either someone 'in house' or via Connexions. Connexions have dedicated Teen Pregnancy/Young Parent advisers who are on the ball regarding practical advice and support. They deal with young fathers as well as mothers (sadly, take-up of services by young dads is less than that of young mums).
It would be someone independent and objective who the young people might be able to talk to without the family pressures - can help a lot. The teen pregnancy adviser at the college I worked at was a teen mum herself so was brilliant with empathy and understanding the issues young parents faced. They can advise about childcare, benefits, you name it. I'd definitely suggest the young people talk to whoever's in their college or try the Connexions centre
Cat x -
Message 12
Posted by bolshy (U7233633) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Phew. Morning sweeters & Cat. Hope all's well with you both.
I thought for ages - well, at least five minutes which for me is an eon - before posting that. I s'pose I just really feel for this girl - & the lad too to a certain extent but I'm afraid in these situations I come over all uber-feminist & think that it's totally the woman's decision. I just hope she's had a chance to at least talk to someone about the options.
Luckily I was much older when I was in her situation - um, thirty, I think, thinking back - but it must be a really scary place to be aged seventeen. Respect to you sweeters for doing such a good job of it. My ex-sil had her first aged sixteen & was left on her own a year later. She coped but admits it was bloody tough.
Just going back to the lad in question: poor kid. I'd imagine he's just trying not to think about it - fingers in ears, lalalala. OH's son is seventeen now & I really don't think he'd be able to cope if he got a girl pregnant. Hm. Seventeen feels so mature when you're that age, doesn't it. -
Message 13
Posted by Silver Jenny (U12795676) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
wn, unless the young man in question has younger siblings or cousins, he may have not had any experience of how much a baby changes the lives of it's parents. If the decision is to keep the baby, he is going to grow up rather more quickly than he planned. 18th birthday party, probably. Gap year, almost certainly no, at this stage of his life.
There is no question of a termination.Â
The only person who can make the final decision on that is the girl. Good that both families are supportive and there is no 'go and never darken my door again' scenario*.
*
[Close to home, I was adopted because my mother's family rejcted her. It was before the days when there was support for unmarried mothers, other than a home for waifs and strays which was where I was deposited!.] -
Message 14
Posted by Auntie Clockwise (U8040384) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Is the young woman really committed to parenting this child, or is the decision not to have a termination based on religious or moral grounds? Apologies if I've missed it upthread, but another option to consider is adoption. Some kind of counselling would be helpful at arriving at a decision and the implications of whatever that decision is.
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Message 15
Posted by Flakey (U14259784) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
They seem to have made one huge choice already when not opting for termination. There must have been some duscussion around that, how they would manage, their immediate future and their plans for education etc ?
Flakey -
Message 16
Posted by bolshy (U7233633) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
There must have been some duscussion around thatÂ
You'd hope so, wouldn't you, Flakey, & hopefully there HAS been much discussion. & as Cat says, not just with the parents.
It's just that the bald statement in the first post: "there is no question of a termination" makes me feel a bit, erm, worried for the girl. -
Message 17
Posted by Flakey (U14259784) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Hi Bolshy Poppy
That doesn not sound insensitive at all. Its a very valid point and an option for all women to consider.
Flakes x -
Message 18
Posted by Flakey (U14259784) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
We crossed BP, yes quite agree, who knows if her choices are limited.
Its just the opening statement of "there is no question of termination" seemed so rock and a hard place to me.
Flakes x -
Message 19
Posted by sweetFeet (U14377598) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
This is why she must seek advise and support outside of the family as Cat suggested.
Mind you, these things are easy to say. I really couldn't see what the problem was when I was in the same position.
Mean while, the foetus doesn't stop growing while people ponder the best solution.
This can be hard when the young dad appears to be in denial. Do we know if the young woman has taken on board the reality of the situation? -
Message 20
Posted by laReine-Astrid (U10636638) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
I would also like to bring up the question of adoption.
A gril that I was at school with found herself in exactly this situation, maybe at 16 rather than 17. Her boyfriend was talking about marriage, they had the parents' support, but J. was determined that she wanted to carry on with her studies and did not want to bring up a baby.
She had the baby it was adopted and she came back to school one year later.
I'm not in touch with her, so who can say how she felt about that decision later on.
The OP is about the boy. I don't see why he should be excluded from all this, whether it's in terms of trying to make face reality or not. What does he want? What does his girlfriend want?
If the parents are truly supportive, rather than trying to impose their own choices, then all options woulde be open to these youngsters. -
Message 21
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Fri, 02 Jul 2010 14:16 GMT, in reply to laReine-Astrid in message 20
Thank you all for your replies so far.
Re. "There is no question of a termination" - to the best of my knowledge, this is the position of the girl herself (of course, she's from a particular background and upbringing, so to what extent it's a free choice is debatable, but not something we can know). I do not know what advice or counselling she and her boyfriend have had, whether with their parents or independently from them. For what it is worth, I wholeheartedly support a woman's right to choose.
The point of my OP was rather more to do with the point made (was it by Bolshy Pippy?) that my friend's son is at least metaphorically sticking his fingers in his ears and going, "la la la" - ie denying the reality of the situation. Is this because he just doesn't have the maturity to comprehend the reality? Presumably it is easier for a boy to fail to get to grips with the situation; it's much less of an option for the girl.
The boy and his girlfriend both have professional career aspirations, and want to go to university to study the courses they were planning before the pregnancy happened. My friends are keen that he should do so (and to the best of my knowledge, so are the girl's parents - though I don't know them). My personal feeling is that they wish to do this with the best of intentions, but by cushioning their son from having to face up to the financial realities of raising a child, I don't know if they're helping him. On the other hand, I wouldn't want to punish him and adversely affect the rest of his life for a simple and actually pretty common mistake. Do his parents have to accept that EITHER they make him leave school and get a job to provide financial support (which will surely bring him face-to-face with reality), OR they provide buckets of support, which enables him to skirt around the true situation? -
Message 22
Posted by bolshy (U7233633) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Oh blimey, wisdomneeded, what a bloody awful situation for everyone. One of those real 'there but for the grace of whoever go all of us' messes. (Sorry to talk about this baby as a 'mess' - probably projecting a few too many of my own feelings onto this.)
OR they provide buckets of support, which enables him to skirt around the true situation?Â
If he is going to be jointly responsible for the child then long-term surely it's better for him to be qualified as something & therefore reasonably employable? If he jacks in all his university plans now, he'll just have to join the tens of thousands of other lads milling around, scrabbling after hardly any jobs. I know it might feel as if his parents are shielding him from the reality of the situation but this might work out better for everyone - baby as well - in the long run.
Oh urgh what a complicated situation. Are they (the prospective parents) intending to stay together as far as you know, wisdomneeded? -
Message 23
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Fri, 02 Jul 2010 14:35 GMT, in reply to laReine-Astrid in message 20
PS I also wanted to say that as this is a new identity, I am in horrendous pre-mod, so please forgive me if replies from me take an age to come through - I sent the OP on Sunday, and it appeared on Friday! Hopefully it will speed up a bit. -
Message 24
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Phew... messages definitely appearing quicker now!
Bolshy Pippy, I think that they aren't really saying! They love each other, they aren't planning on splitting up. Neither are they planning on living together and raising the baby together. As far as I know, the girl will continue to live with her parents, who seem to be prepared to undertake or arrange most of the childcare. My friend is prepared to help with childcare, but the details of just how much help and what sort are still very much up in the air.
I think that the reality of the baby's arrival is likely to affect whether the boy and girl decide to stay together long-term, but whether positively or negatively, I wouldn't like to say just now!
I very much take your point that it would be best for the boy in the long term to get the professional qualification he is seeking - and probably also better for his girlfriend and baby for him to do so. I think the difficulty is that by carrying on "as before", it helps the boy to act as if nothing very much is going to change for him, and my friend is struggling with how, lovingly, to help him to face up to reality. The more I think about this, the more I think he will be able to avoid doing so if he isn't expected to DO something to show he assumes a degree of responsibility - probably financial. He has a part-time job; perhaps he needs to be made to save a good proportion of this income to go towards the costs of a new baby. The more both sets of parents accommodate the situation for their children (from the best of motives), the easier it is for the boy to act as if nothing's changed - at least, until the baby arrives... -
Message 25
Posted by Bearhug (U2258283) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
It is possible to do university with a baby in tow, but I wouldn't recommend it. OTOH, I wouldn't recommend doing working or anything else.
So if they're thinking of doing that - what are their options there?
If they stay at school to finish exams first, who will look after the baby in lesson time?
What courses are they thinking of? (For example, a language course with a year abroad may not be so practical, nor medicine.)
What facilities do the universities they're thinking of have in the way of creches? Most universities do have them, but who can use them and what the costs are, I don't know.
Is a local university more feasible? Could they stay at home while studying? What about OU?
More than any of the practical stuff - what would the comparative costs of it all be? Not only would there be course fees, there will be all the added baby costs - care, accommodation, etc, etc. It would be possible, but it would be very, very hard, particularly if they don't stay together - were they planning to go to the same uni? That would make a difference, too.
And then, if they don't go, what are the options? Adoption, or keeping the baby, parental support, job options, etc? At 17, this will be even more difficult than at 27 or 37, because you probably don't have any idea of the costs of running a home and everything that's involved just for yourself, let alone dependents.
Nonetheless, I am very much of the opinion that if you have a major decision to make (and you can't get more major than this), then you need to arm yourself with facts as far as is possible before you're really in a position to make a decision. And then you need to have alternatives in mind for when things don't go to plan, like you fail your A-levels because the baby's had colic and kept you up all night for several nights in a row and your brain is cotton wool.
How you get someone to face up to the truth when they really don't want to - er, dunno. Never really managed it myself. -
Message 26
Posted by bolshy (U7233633) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
I've got to head off now (I'm never certain of ML etiquette: it seems terribly self-important to announce that I'm off - who cares - but it feels really rude just to vanish in the middle of a fascinating discussion ....) but will be really interested to see how this progresses.
Love to y'all xx -
Message 27
Posted by gigglemahanaz2 (U14257954) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Wisdomneeded.......having read your OP and the replies here's my twopenny worth..........
I'm RC and went to RC's schools.......in secondary school there were 4 girls in the 4th year (14/15 year olds) who found themselves in this situation.........one had a termanation....one opted for adoption....two kept their babies..........I've seen all 4 at diffrent times over the years and all of them regretted thier decisions........
The two who kept their babies resented the kiddies as they saw those kids as restricting them, the mothers, from doing what they wanted to do ie being teenagers....clubs, travel, education and jobs, the other 2 were unable to have any more kids for gynie reasons.
I guess what I'm trying to say is this....it's the girl's choice what direction she wants to take and no one else's, if she wants to stay on in education, as long as she has supportive parents and BF parents are willing to help out, than go for it but she should first find out how hard it would be to study and look after a child and wheather she'd be able to cope with night feeds, nappy changes, teething and illness, if she feels she could cope more power to her.
But and there is a but.......the BF needs to take his head out of the sand and realise that, if GF keeps the baby, things may not work out between them, he needs to made to realise that he'll have to pay towards the child's up keep, how will this child affect his future career and relationships, how will a futre GF/partner/wife react towards the child as let's face it her, he'll have to have contact with the mother as well as the child, will he be able to deal with any jelousy and/or resentment.
It's fine saying he's only young etc needs to have fun but what about his GF? IMHO the same applies........if he's man enough to lie down for his pleasure he has to be man enough to stand up and face his resposibilites as if he doesn't the child will suffer.
My OH's dad did a bunk when he was a toddler only to turn up again when he was 21 wanting to have a relationship with him, to be fair OH gave him chance after chance but his dad failed in Elton John gilter style circa 1971........now OH has very little to do with his dad where as his Mum is trying to establish a relationship between the two, OH's view is too little too late and can't be asked.
This young couple really do need to sit down, alone, and have a serious talk about the future, both thiers and thier childs.
I'm sorry for sounding harsh and old fashioned but there are so many poor kids out there who, for whatever reason, are unwanted and unloved or resented and hated by parents who never really wanted them and had them for reasons they can't explain.
Again I'm sorry for sounding harsh I don't mean to, I hope this works out for them whatever they decide to do and wish them the best. -
Message 28
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
I don't think that you sound particularly harsh at all, gigglemahanaz2.
Question - how do you get someone to take their head out of the sand? That seems to be the difficulty.
My own view is that the boy may be able to play dumb for quite a long time if the girl's family assume most of the practical responsibilities, and particularly if they don't stay together. I think that if nothing else, psychologically this will affect him in years to come (future relationships, as you say - and his own understanding of himself as a person. His future ideas of fatherhood, guilt - who knows what else?). He can't shrug it off for ever. I think he has no idea of what a huge thing this will be for the rest of his life - but maybe at 17 that's not such a bad thing. -
Message 29
Posted by Redbookish (U1335018) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Fri, 02 Jul 2010 19:00 GMT, in reply to wisdomneeded
I very much take your point that it would be best for the boy in the long term to get the professional qualification he is seeking - and probably also better for his girlfriend and baby for him to do so.Â
I'm sorry, but I think it's *far* more important for the young woman to have support to get her qualifications. If that means the young man studyong part-tiome and working part-time, then so be it. In the way of these things separated fathers rarely pay the true cost of raising a child, and single mothers tend to worse poverty than their children's father. It is imperative that the young mother has roper training and qualifications, as she is likely to be the main coper in all of this.
And if he already has a part-time job, well -- that seems to me to be the bleedin' obvious: that that income should be /entirely/ at the disposal of the family unit he and his girlfriend have created.
With all the parental support he's getting, which is admirable, I can't help feeling -- from what you say -- that he is getting off rather lightly. I would be far more concerned for the young woman. -
Message 30
Posted by sweetFeet (U14377598) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Yes Red, that struck me too.
She may find herself alone in the future. She needs to be able to properly support herself and her child.
The father can and may walk away at any time , but she will be left as provider for and be a role model for the daughter or son she gives birth to.
It never occurred for me to stop my studies, indeed, you grow up blooming quickly, in many ways when you become a parent.
I was lucky in many ways, the old grant system worked for me, as did a great network of friends and the child's father.
Sitting at home and hoping that the man will bring home the bacon would seem to me a very sad future for this young woman. -
Message 31
Posted by captainbenayoun (U13326760) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
I "got" pregnant at 19, 30 plus years ago and there were not too many options. We married - in retrospect the wrong decision, but family and society expected/demanded it. Husband/father drifted away (we were far too young, I attach no blame to him). I have just (well still am, truth be told) celebrated my DD"s 40th birthday (the love of my life)and my early retirement.
My regret is that I married her father, but and more importantly that, following the breakdown of that marriage, we did not stay in contact, so that DD could know her father.
Whichever way your friends child goes know this - I did not have the life I expected. It has been so much better. Having my daughter was the making of me. My regret is that her father and I were not mature enough at the time of our break up to keep it together (in the sense of keeping in touch, at least) for DD's sake. I know that he would have been as proud of her as I am. And I am sorry that he is not around to enjoy her birthday in the same way that I am - though I am sure he thinks of her, he was a good guy.
The moral of my story? Goodness knows. I guess it is just to say that life throws curve balls and the only thing that one can do is to .... (umm what do you do with curve balls? Time to shut up, I think.)
Best of luck for the kids, they will get through it.
Cap -
Message 32
Posted by wisdomneeded (U14535240) on Friday, 2nd July 2010
Thank you for sharing your story, Cap - it is really helpful hearing from people with direct personal experience of this kind of situation.
To clarify to (I think) Redbookish and Sweeters - as far as getting qualifications is concerned, I don't think it is either/or for the boy and the girl; I think both sets of parents want them both to go on to study and qualify. My point was more that it was likely to be better for the girl if her boyfriend pursued his studies rather than dropping out and looking for work now which is likely to be pretty badly paid. If they stay together, or if he at least accepts a degree of financial responsibility, he will be better placed (in the long term)to be a provider for the child with professional qualifications.
I absolutely feel that the girl is inevitably going to bear the brunt of this situation, and she will need as much support as possible to look after herself and the baby, and fulfil her career aspirations. It's just that the focus of my interest in this messy situation is how to bring home to a 17-year-old boy the magnitude of what he's involved in. I don't think he can be "made" to grasp it without being a bit more involved in some of the direct consequences of his actions eg through contributing financially, or practically getting involved in the babycare. But the loving concern of both sets of parents, from the best possible motives, seems to me to be interfering with that process. I think I'm moving towards concluding that the parents need to be a bit tougher on their son. But it must be so hard. -
Message 33
Posted by metro-mouse (U3068238) on Saturday, 3rd July 2010
< It's just that the focus of my interest in this messy situation is how to bring home to a 17-year-old boy the magnitude of what he's involved in.>
Do/did any prospective parents understand the 'magnitude' of pregnancy whether it was planned or unplanned and be they 19 or 39? Had I known I would not have done it.
< I don't think he can be "made" to grasp it without being a bit more involved in some of the direct consequences of his actions eg through contributing financially, or practically getting involved in the babycare.>
But it is not real yet is it, not until the baby and its continual demands for the next few decades arrives, he will find out soon enough.
Why? To what end? This sounds awfully Old Testament to me, the deed is done the outcome will be what it will, what do you want to see done? Parade them in sackcloth and ashes, tattoo 'Harlot' on the young woman's forehead?
I would be more concerned about the failure of contraception, was it lack of education in school or family? Fifteen years ago the then teen kids came home from school with bucketloads of excellent info leaflets, has this been stopped? If so a bit of campaigning there might be useful. mm
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