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Meditators?

• Message 1. 

  Posted by aminam (U2277964) on Sunday, 10th February 2013

  I know we've tried this before in the past but ... I'm trying again with a meditation thread. A bit like I'm trying again with meditation.
  
  I have done it on and off for years but have decided to try to improve my practice after several months where I just didn't / couldn't / didn't want to.
  
  I'm shocked by how "unproductive" it is. I mean, I know it's not meant to be be a competition in productivity but I'm a bit fed up with how hard I'm finding it - a real slog. Half the time my brain does the monkey thing and scampers away - the other half, I'm on the verge of sleep. On occasions I drop off.
  
  At the moment I'm just following the breath and sitting for half an hour (timed). I know it's important and I know I should persevere but most of the time I just feel like stopping.
  
  Any words of encouragement? Does it get better? Is there a "better"?
  
  Am x

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• Message 2

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by mistle_thrush (U3279940) on Sunday, 10th February 2013

  Hi Am
  
  Sorry to hear you have got rather stuck - I think if it feels like a constant slog as you describe it'd be very hard for anyone to stay motivated!
  
  I can empathise with both the sleep and the butterfly mind... I find certain meditations work better for me at different times of day (eg no lying down ones in the evening!) and have enjoyed experimenting with different places too (eg mindful breathing exercises on buses or trains which I find bizarrely calming).
  
  I've only started fairly recently, but I did an online course (google Be Mindful Online if interested) and it was brilliant. You can do it at your own pace but having a bit of structure helped me, and there are audio downloads each week which I still use now.
  
  Oh and they put real emphasis on freeing yourself (or trying to) of expectation for the session, and not blaming or being harsh with yourself if your mind wanders etc. Both of which are very helpful reminders for me.
  
  Also there are lots of books with CDs of guided meditations - might be worth a try for a bit of variety?
  
  Good luck, and thanks for reminding me that I would feel better if I made a bit more time for meditation, too.
  
  m_t
  
  

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• Message 3

  , in reply to message 2.

  Posted by aminam (U2277964) on Sunday, 10th February 2013

  Thank you m_t
  
  I have books coming out of my ears, including some really good ones like Martine Batchelor's "Meditation for Life". I have also done the odd online thing. I just think sometimes there's no substitute for "just sitting there". In the past I have always begun "just" with the breath because I find it perfect in its power and simplicity. At some stage during my session I "normally" find that the monkey at least calms down enough to do some of the other things like a bit of compassion meditation and a bit of "What is this?"
  
  At the moment though it's all I can do to sit through the session, stay awake and remember what I'm supposed to be doing. I know I'm contributing to good karma just by doing it rather than not doing it, so that's a reassurance. And the doc took my blood pressure the other day and was most impressed at the figures. So evidently there is benefit. I just want to stop beating myself up for being distracted and tired!
  
  You're right - different times of day, different approaches. If only I could schlepp myself out of bed early enough to do some at the start of the day. Maybe tomorrow ...
  
  Am x

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• Message 4

  , in reply to message 3.

  Posted by Alsdouble (U524298) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  Id just stop if I were you Ams.
  
  Do some relaxation work yes, but actual meditation 'work' cannot be toyed with, you either do it every day forever, or until you stop, or nothing.
  
  Restarting is not really possible.
  
  
  It's possible you expect too much from it, which is a basic flaw. Expect nothing and maybe. It's such a subtle difference it takes a lifetime to understand what happens with meditation and the mind.
  
  I practiced from 1977 to 1985 every day solidly, never missed a day.
  
  I tried restarting a couple of years ago. It was pointless.
  
  The best form of meditation to do for life is mindful meditation walking, which you can do any time, any place, but don't stop the traffic.
  
  Lift forward down, which you can stretch out to a thousand touch points if you have the required concentration.
  
  I still do it, occasionally, down the park, when it's deserted wet and cold. The best time.

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• Message 5

  , in reply to message 4.

  Posted by aminam (U2277964) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  "I tried restarting a couple of years ago. It was pointless."
  
  Well ... maybe. In a sense it's meant to be pointless, isn't it? I dunno als, I've always felt that it was helpful in some way and in an ideal world I would be that person who did it every day without fail. Yet you're right - it's not easy to say why.
  
  I don't know what I'm "expecting" from it any more.
  
  Gonna carry on for a while, though I'm finding it quite tough going, as I said.
  
  If I lived near to a meditation group I think I'd consider going. The nearest one I can find would necessitate nearly four hours in the car all told.
  
  Am x

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• Message 6

  , in reply to message 5.

  Posted by Alsdouble (U524298) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  Sall about faith aint it.
  
  Faith in 'the practice.'
  
  That thing which keeps you going.
  
  Takes some hammering faith does, during life's journey.
  
  Course all I know is samatha meditation. Very concentrated,, very dangerous. Always best done with supervision.
  
  

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• Message 7

  , in reply to message 6.

  Posted by aminam (U2277964) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  "Takes some hammering faith does, during life's journey."
  
  Indeed it does. Indeed it does.
  
  Als, thanks. I don't know anything about samatha. I might have a look but I think I'll just breathe in and out a lot.
  
  They always say that you'll find your meditation teacher when you are ready to find your meditation teacher. Bizarrely I have never found a meditation teacher. I wonder what that should tell us?
  
  You seen the news? (No, I'm not talking about the pope. Though that isn't without its sadness either.)
  
  Am x

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• Message 8

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by Thanks for all the fish (U10654037) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  I learned TM a few years ago, and to my shame - the results were amazing - I have lapsed of late.
  
  Don't beat yourself up for your thoughts drifting in; acknowledge them, and let them drift off again as you refocus on your mantra / breath / candle flame / whatever.
  
  If you fall asleep, that's fine, but it's better to not encourage that by meditating upright and not last thing at night.
  
  Half an hour is rather a long time, though. Even a TM session isn't that long!
  
  Regardless, taking the time out to do this will be doing you good, even if it doesn't feel like it sometimes.

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• Message 9

  , in reply to message 7.

  Posted by Alsdouble (U524298) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  Quite shocked Ams. I have just joined peet's place, and I also have the same name on Twitter.
  
  Many ML people I would like to still see their name every day and you are one of those people.
  
  Nothing lasts for ever is such a smug buddhist thing but, Phew! so true.
  
  
  Hard, stark, in your face truth. You can't beat it! Why settle for less.

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• Message 10

  , in reply to message 9.

  Posted by aminam (U2277964) on Monday, 11th February 2013

  "Many ML people I would like to still see their name every day and you are one of those people."
  
  OK. You've just given me my first tearful moment in this grim saga and I suspect it won't be the last. The feeling is entirely mutual.
  
  I guess you're right. Here it is. Impermanence, red in tooth and claw.
  
  Am x

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