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Wot can't speak ........

• Message 1.聽

  Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  I know there have been many messages on the Boards about how good (or otherwise!!) MD was, well, just for info 鈥� the figures below are from the BARB website, which shows the viewing figures. They are for the same period 鈥� Spring.
  
  DATE VIEWING FIGS
  (In Millions)
  
  01/04/01 3.70
  08/04/01 3.94
  15/04/01 4.05
  
  31/03/02 3.92
  07/04/02 3.50
  14/04/02 3.79
  
  
  01/04/07 2.66
  08/04/07 2.61
  15/04/07 2.60
  
  30/03/08 1.81
  06/04/08 2.36
  13/04/08 2.46
  
  Copper Paul says 鈥淥h dear, it seems you haven't a good word to say about any of them? And Monty 'lacks training in gardening skills'? Amazing how he got away with it for so long, isn't it? (Good grief)鈥�
  
  The simple answer to that is (as Peter Seabrook and other 鈥榯ime served鈥檊ardeners have been saying for years) 鈥� He didn鈥檛.
  
  Another message says 鈥淯nder Monty the show lost many thousands of viewers so I guess they voted with there feet, against his organic mantra鈥�.
  
  This is true in part 鈥� the truth is he actually lost well over a million viewers.
  
  

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• Message 2

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by the cycling gardener (U2350416) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  Interesting. The figures for 2001 and 2002 were on Alan Titchmarsh's watch when I suspect he gained a good number of viewers on the back of the very popular Ground Force.
  
  I think GW at that time latched onto the growing awareness of garden design in the public consciousness which it interpreted through its inspirational content such as the memorable garden visits with Stephen Lacey, planting design and associations as well as really useful timely gardening advice from a gardener who generously invited us, weekly, into his own much loved garden. Alan's care, ownership and pure understated enthusiasm were laid bare in every programme. Berryfields, by contrast,is a horticultural experiment without any sense of real purpose except as a demonstration garden for TV viewers. I know the general consensus on this board is for the show to get back to basics, to 'real' gardening but I wonder to what extent the concentration on basic gardening techniques rather than creative gardening has alienated some viewers?

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• Message 3

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by Ken Smart (U1158196) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  This is true in part 鈥� the truth is he actually lost well over a million viewers.聽
  Anything that has a stamp of quality about it is likely to lose viewers these days. However, I'm sure that the problem is related to the increasing choice that viewers now have before them. I did like Monty Don, and was very disappointed to learn that he couldn't continue. He was my kind of gardener (regardless of what Peter Seabrook may say), and I'm sure we haven't heard the last of him. Only time will tell how GW evolves in future, but if the object of the exercise is to chase ratings, it's likely that anyone who takes their gardening seriously will be less inclined to bother with it.
  

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• Message 4

  , in reply to message 3.

  Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  Ah Peter Seabrook, the doyen of TV gardeners. He didn't last long, did he?
  
  Like it or not MD was liked, enjoyed and respected by a great number of people. Also presenters are only part of a GW programme, and are 'at the mercy' of the producers/directors/cameramen. Therefore a fall in viewing figures could well mean that the programmes have not been well put together which, by and large, they increasingly haven't been.

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• Message 5

  , in reply to message 4.

  Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  I suspect the down turn in GW viewing numbers is as much about the production team as Monty. After all, he only presented what they didn't leave on the virtual cutting room floor and they choose the subject matter and guest presenters as well as the scheduling of content and outside visits.
  
  I have also said for many years that the lack of ownership at Berryfields was a problem but in fact, the much loved, entertaining, informative and well produced Beechgrove Garden series also comes from a communal garden which is not owned by any of the presenters yet manages to convey relevant, useful, interesting and timely information about jobs, plants, ideas, products and so on as well as running senible trials and reporting back on results with a team of 4 or 5 regular presenters.

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• Message 6

  , in reply to message 5.

  Posted by Joe_the_Gardener (U3478064) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  My wife, not a practising gardener, is the bellwether (if she doesn't mind me referring to her in ovine terms) of the floating vote when it comes to GW presenters. Titchmarsh got the thumbs up as horti-beefcake, Monty didn't, CB was so-so, Toby doesn't really cut it. So the variations in watching figures may have a simple explanation!
  
  Joe

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• Message 7

  , in reply to message 2.

  Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  Hi Cycling Gardener
  
  I fully agree with you about the inspirational garden visits (one of the things I asked for, when the GW person asked what we wanted, was to see these brought back). I also agree with you that the planting design, the really useful timely advice, etc all combined to make GW the success it was. but aren鈥檛 they the basic ingredients of 鈥榬eal鈥� gardening?. With the best will in the world no-one could have been inspired by the design (or lack of it) in the long borders at Berryfields. MD sat at the side of these borders, when the plants were going in and said 鈥業 haven鈥檛 really got any grand plan for these鈥� 鈥� which was painfully obvious, when the stuff grew. It was definitely more 鈥楥hum鈥� than 鈥楥helsea鈥�.
  
  In the past we had a good combination of both creative ideas 鈥� along with very basic things.
  
  A good quality, informative, inspirational programme will automatically attract the audience. They don鈥檛 need to be 鈥榗hased鈥�.
  

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• Message 8

  , in reply to message 1.

  Posted by Stressed out (U11163734) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  Pity the figures don't go back a bit further as it would give a better average.
  
  But over the period quoted it looks to me like 1 in 3 viewers voted with their remote. And to be honest I am not surprised.
  
  Just hope that Toby can pull the premier gardening program in the UK out of malaise that Monty Dull put it into.
  

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• Message 9

  , in reply to message 8.

  Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Friday, 14th November 2008

  Hi again RowanCottage
  
  "Pity the figures don't go back a bit further as it would give a better average.... "
  
  28/03/99 4.72 Million
  04/04/99 3.78 "
  11/04/99 4.64 "
  
  26/03/00 4.01 "
  02/04/00 4.47 "
  09/04/00 4.20 "
  
  25/03/01 3.35 "
  01/04/01 3.70 "
  08/04/01 3.94 "
  
  All my friends were amongst the 'remote' users!!
  
  
  
  
  
  

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• Message 10

  , in reply to message 9.

  Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Saturday, 15th November 2008

  "Monty Dull"
  
  Good grief, I can't believe you said that.

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• Message 11

  , in reply to message 9.

  Posted by Stressed out (U11163734) on Saturday, 15th November 2008

  happytobyfan
  
  Oops that makes it look even worse as an average, I had expected in the region of 4m.

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• Message 12

  , in reply to message 11.

  Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Saturday, 15th November 2008

  Hi again RowanCottage
  
  In view of the 'requests' for a tribute to him - You'll probably agree with me that he should get some kind of 'recognition award' - after all, to make over 2 million people disappear is no meant feat !!

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• Message 13

  , in reply to message 12.

  Posted by stainedsteel (U12904524) on Saturday, 15th November 2008

  Why don't you post some figures for Coronation Street, or any other long-running programme over the same period? Fact is that all of these programmes have lost viewers. Corrie used to get over 20m regularly. Now it does well to get over 12m. And no Monty Don to blame for it!
  
  The really big change has been the growth of the internet over the past decade. Combined with the introduction by Sky of dozens of extra channels to watch, there is more competition for leisure time now than there ever was in the 80s and 90s.
  
  I'm not a big fan of Monty as a gardener but he made up for a lot by being an excellent presenter. I agree with others about the increase in annoying camera work (although this has been much better lately) and possibly that many viewers can't relate to Berryfields. But the effect, if any, of these issues pales into insignificance beside the birth and growth of the internet and the advent of Sky TV.

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• Message 14

  , in reply to message 5.

  Posted by Apple (U3132210) on Saturday, 15th November 2008

  May I second the sentiments in message 5 from Obelixx.
  
  
  
  Please stop blaming Monty - he, at times, wanted things to be different but the content, scheduling etc was not down to him!

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