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GW review
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Message 1.Â
Posted by ann (U2872048) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
I wrote last year that I felt Toby and Co were not right for GW - yes he is knowledgeable, but as I said at the time charisma and that X factor are also needed. (Alan has it, Joe hasnt. Monty has it, Carol hasnt quite got it, but is extremely likeable. Geof H had it, Bob Flowerdew hasnt. ) I feel I gave Toby and Alys a fair crack of the whip and watched hopefully......
Now here we are in the middle of winter and Im reviewing GW's new presenters. Sorry. Alys and Toby just DO NOT CUT THE MUSTARD. This is obvious to many who are walking with their remotes and -perhaps like me - turning to Sky UK Gradens for old re-runs of Alan and Geof Hamilton programmes which crammed so many gardening tips and info. into each programme. The fact that I watch them over and over is testament to their quality - now so sadly lacking in what was the flagship Gardening programme on Ö÷²¥´óÐã. When will Ö÷²¥´óÐã listen to the licence payers and give us what we want? My wishlist would be for Monty to return - if he's now well of course Failing that, Gardeners Question Time is the only Ö÷²¥´óÐã offering which has remained 'top dollar' on Radio 2, so perhaps they could televise that!! -
Message 2
Posted by Ken Smart (U1158196) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
Now here we are in the middle of winter and Im reviewing GW's new presenters. Sorry. Alys and Toby just DO NOT CUT THE MUSTARD.Â
I'm afraid Ann, that there is little to be gained in wishing for a new set of presenters for Gardeners' World at this particular time. It's all been settled, and unless the principals decide to walk, I'm certain the contracts will be in place for the coming season at least. It is behind the scenes that we should all now be concentrating our efforts - assuming that it's still the same set of dead-heads that were at the helm last year.
I'm hopeful that Toby will now have the confidence to 'do his own thing', and that this will prove to be free of gimmicks. I also hope that we can get some natural chat between Toby and Alys, as the scripted stuff really was embarrassing last year. I worry about Alys. She's been catapulted into the programme from the relative obscurity of background gardener, to TV celebrity. I say 'celebrity', as she's got her very own book on the shelves just now, giving us the benefits of her lifetime in gardening. Talk about cashing in on good fortune with indecent haste. I would like to see her do what she undoubtedly does best - give short simple tips about propogation and other 'common garden' matters. Forget the dog and bicycle, and concentrate on the bit part you've been granted. Joe is now spoiled goods, and for me, there's no way back for him. Although I have huge respect for Carol as a gardener, I find the distractions which surround her too much for my sensitivities. I would be happy to see another experienced female coming in to fill the slot. Besides, Carol can't be altogether happy about how things have transpired.
My only real request for the coming year would be an appeal for the creation of an area of the garden which would represent the average size of land gardened by the majority of the viewing public. Let us see what they can make of something we can all relate to. Flowers, shrubs, trees, vegetables, sheds, compost heaps, greenhouses - all elements which have to be incorporated into many viewers' gardens. Creating enormous borders (hot to cool) is of limited interest to me, but making the very best of limited space really would take my attention. It could even be redesigned every year (who said there was no place for designers on GW?), which would keep it fresh. All this could be accomplished without silly camerawork - unless of course, we have a silly cameraperson. -
Message 3
Posted by malanD (U7337386) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
Oh, please Ann, why start this tired old debate that has been talked about, discussed, hung out to dry and well past its interest date - again? I am sure like me, most of us have had enough of this same old topic.
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Message 4
Posted by daydaises (U10178313) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
Right now I would welcome any presenter on any gardening programme! We gardeners are so neglected on TV. My inability to get my hands dirty because of the weather coupled with no gardening TV is driving me crazy! Gardening is my valium and I am suffering from withdrawal symptoms. Please Help!
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Message 5
Posted by Greengirl (U5195373) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
Absolutely agree with you daydaisies, this is the best time for gardening progs when we've nothing to do & we're desperate for anything gardening at all.
I also agree with Ken, gardening in the real world of average sized gardens would be far more appropriate for most of us. -
Message 6
Posted by Stressed out (U11163734) on Wednesday, 4th February 2009
Ann
Give him a little bit of a chance, he has not had time to put his own stamp on GW and they also need to look very carefully at the production team as well. They also need a new garden to work in.
All I can say he is a lot better than the smug previous incumbent. -
Message 7
Posted by pottingshedpiskie (U5408755) on Thursday, 5th February 2009
I was sure that Toby has already introduced the idea of making a garden which is similar in size to the average modern garden. Didn't we see him standing in an area that had an ordinary 6 x 4 greenhouse which he said was more like the one that most people would have in their gardens - unheated and only a glass and metal frame construction?
Maybe he's waiting for the new season so that he can show us how to to do things from scratch - starting when most of us would start?
Or could it be that I'm having severe gardening television withdrawal symptoms, and have imagined the lot?
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Message 8
Posted by greenfinger (U13641674) on Thursday, 5th February 2009
I have to say that Toby is a bit too bland for me, however I find Alys a breath of fresh air. She knows what she is talking about and has a quirky, different approach which I find interesting.
She is also more likely to appeal to the new wave of gardeners who are starting to grow their own food, many of whom are younger than the traditional Gardeners World viewer.
Move with the times? -
Message 9
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Friday, 6th February 2009
Smug, RowanCottage, smug? Good grief, you've gone too far.
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Message 10
Posted by thegardener (U13776890) on Friday, 6th February 2009
I will agree Monty was not smug.
But I am not sure if the proper words to describe Monty are allowed to be posted on this board. So I will leave it to you both, to argue about a true description of Monty's time on GW. -
Message 11
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Friday, 6th February 2009
This is tyrany, now stop it, now
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Message 12
Posted by Sparky (U6716422) on Friday, 6th February 2009
My OH always though Monty was made of corduroy
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Message 13
Posted by Stressed out (U11163734) on Friday, 6th February 2009
Paul N
Smug was the shortest and most polite word I could find -
Message 14
Posted by green-buddha (U11615833) on Friday, 6th February 2009
"Smug" is certainly a short word, but it's not a "polite" word, and where Monty is concerned it's not an apt word either.
The Cambridge Dictionary definition of the word smug is: "Too pleased or satisfied about something you have achieved or something you know."
Monty is a humble man, having known great failure in his previous career, and where gardening is concerned his pleasure and satisfaction come not from his achievements or his knowledge, but from his sense of wonder at the yearly miracle of the cycle of nature - something that all true gardeners share. To describe Monty as "smug" is to totally misunderstand him. -
Message 15
Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Friday, 6th February 2009
"....... Monty is a humble man, having known great failure in his previous career, and where gardening is concerned his pleasure and satisfaction come not from his achievements or his knowledge......"
Since he was sadly lacking in any gardening 'achievements' and possessed next to no knowledge (apart from growing carrots and onions), he would have been justified in being 'humble' (although he never seemed that way to me). I saw a little bit of a GW repeat a couple of days ago - when Carol was planting about half a dozen kinds of herbacious perennials. Common ones - which many gardeners grow and know about, he had to ask her questions such as: how tall do they grow,when do they flower, are they hardy? - This, from the person who had been put in charge of the 'flagship' gardening programme. I was cringing with embarrassment. Good Luck to Toby - a 'proper' (Knowledgeable) gardener. -
Message 16
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Friday, 6th February 2009
Perhaps he was coaxing further information on the plants from her, for the benefit of the viewers. Perhaps he already knew the answers but didn't want to appear...........smug?
Come on peeps, such criticism of MD is out of order. Now both of you go and sit on the Naughty Step. -
Message 17
Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Friday, 6th February 2009
Didn't look that way to me. (Are you adding 'acting' to his list of 'qualifications' (I use the term loosely !!)
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Message 18
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Friday, 6th February 2009
Happytobyfan
I have been restrained so far.
Just, please, be happy with Toby.
You don't need to be unpleasant about other presenters.
Or maybe you get off on that sort of thing?
Very easy peasy from the comfort of your own computer, isn't it? -
Message 19
Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
Happytobyfan - the kind of questioning you complain about is what the current production team thinks of as a suitable way to present info to gardening viewers. Otherwise Carol would simply have had to tell us herself how tall they grow etc and that might tax our brains and her presenting skills too much.
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Message 20
Posted by pinktequila (U2803141) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
A tad harsh on ALys I feel. I can understand you not being keen on her presenting style, personally I don't mind it. Hoever, to criticise her for writing a book, suggesting she is cashing in and she should just stay in the background giving tips on 'common garden' matters is really quite nasty and insulting to someone who has trained more extensively in gardening than any of the other presenters, inc. in New York at their botanical gardens I think. Why shoujld she not share her ideas in a book? Have you read the book? Or are you just being nasty?
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Message 21
Posted by happytobyfan (U13663471) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
Nooj
I've never been "unpleasant about other presenters" - in common with most people I loved GH and AT. I like all the others (obviously some more than others). I like Carol very much, I miss Rachel and Sarah. I've read an awful lot of unkind things written about Joe Swift - and, much as I hate fruit and veg stuff, I still Like the guy. However, along with all my friends - who no longer watch the show at all, I have very strong feelings abut the person who ruined my Friday evening.
So, sorry to disappoint you, but I just "get off" on the same normal stuff as everyone else.
Obelixx - At some point, Sky will show a repeat of the GW that had MD asking Penny Meadmore questions (on a number of things that he had advocated in previous prgrammes.) Was very enlightening. -
Message 22
Posted by greenfinger (U13641674) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
Its very nasty. Alys is Head Gardener at Berryfields for heavens sake. The comments are just so disrespectful.
Some people are 'stick in the muds' (how apt) who seem to enjoy putting others down just for the sake of it. -
Message 23
Posted by Ken Smart (U1158196) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
to criticise her for writing a book, suggesting she is cashing inÂ
I thought I'd done a little more than suggest. Would she have produced a book if she hadn't got a bit-part in GW? If the answer is 'No', then I'm correct.
quite nasty and insulting to someone who has trained more extensively in gardening than any of the other presenters, inc. in New York at their botanical gardensÂ
I think you're guilty of hyperbole. There is nothing other than a genuine expression of my opinions in my posting - this of course is not to suggest that my opinion is more valid than those of anyone else. Honesty should never cause offence. I was unaware of her stint in New York, but this will probably explain her sub-standard vocabulary.
Have you read the book?Â
You're having a laugh.
Or are you just being nasty?Â
No - I always suppress any temptation to be nasty (unless it's towards an inept production team). -
Message 24
Posted by thegardener (U13776890) on Saturday, 7th February 2009
On another note does anyone know if Joe will be making a fool of himself again on his allotment.
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Message 25
Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Sunday, 8th February 2009
I agree. I thought it was a well known fact that writing a book gives one gravitas as well as income. Alan Titchmarsh did it in the early 80s, long before he became a TV gardener. Beth Chatto and Rosemary Verey did it long before they became venerable and famous. Many other gardeners have gon that way before and will do in future.
Why on earth shouldn't Alys do it when she has so much knowledge to share? I also enjoy her slots on GW, finding her presentation clear and concise. She's a gardener who happens to be on TV.
Just look at all the cries of disdain when they give the Chelsea lunch time slot to Nicky Chapman who is a presenter, not a gardener. -
Message 26
Posted by Trillium (U2170869) on Sunday, 8th February 2009
And Alys is an extremely good writer. Reminds me of the style of Monty's lovely and much missed Observer columns. Dan Pearson isn't in the same league.
Yes, her book did seem to come out astonishingly soon after her first appearances on GW, but that's part and parcel of the role these days. There is both demand for, and revenue (to the Ö÷²¥´óÐã) to be had from such linked publications, so naturally they will happen. -
Message 27
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Sunday, 8th February 2009
While we are on the subject of presenters' books, dear h (bless him) recently came home with Carol Klein's Cook your Own
Did someone say that there was going to be a TV series as a follow up to Grow your Own? -
Message 28
Posted by enilaup (U12299060) on Sunday, 8th February 2009
Ah yes, Trillium. Sundays just haven't been the same since Monty stopped writing his column in the Observer. Wouldn't it be lovely if he could start something up again, now he seems to be well on the way to recovery and isn't any longer bogged down with television work.
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Message 29
Posted by Trillium (U2170869) on Sunday, 8th February 2009
And Fleur Olby's beautiful photos too. Worth getting up early on a Sunday morning for.
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Message 30
Posted by Gianttrowel (U10674701) on Monday, 9th February 2009
Ah so there are at least 2 readers of the observer.
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Message 31
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Monday, 9th February 2009
3
I too looked forward so much to the musings on a Sunday morning - he seemed to hit the mood right for the gardening year no matter which part of the country you live in - and his style of writing has always been a pleasure.
When, and if you want to Monty, it would be good to have you back at the Observer.
Sod the Soil Association (that's a gardening term, mods) come back to to give us our weekly fix -
Message 32
Posted by green-buddha (U11615833) on Monday, 9th February 2009
"Sod the Soil Association (that's a gardening term, mods) come back to give us our weekly fix"
Amen to that Monty -
Message 33
Posted by real_monty (U7742669) on Monday, 9th February 2009
Thanks for all kind words about my Observer pieces. Funnily enough I have just -today- finished a book about my own garden and have drawn on some of that work for it. It will come out in October I think.
I am afraid that there is no chance of me returning to Gardener's World in any capacity. Those days are done and good luck to the existing team. However I am working on new television projects as well as two more books .
By the way my post with the Soil Association is entirely honorary and involves no duties other than standing up and being counted for something that I have long supported and believed in. It is not a job (and certainly no money changes hands) just one of a number of charities that I actively support.
I do hope that you are all coping with the weather - we have been snowbound for over a week now.
best wishes
Monty
PS I am taking part in Question Time on Thursday so tune in to offer moral support or abuse according to your inclination... -
Message 34
Posted by enilaup (U12299060) on Monday, 9th February 2009
It would be great to have him back doing his weekly column but I'd also love to see him back on TV - I'm just greedy!!
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Message 35
Posted by ann (U2872048) on Monday, 9th February 2009
Monty Im delighted you are working on a new TV project - Im sure I speak for many many people who will look forward to that very much indeed.
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Message 36
Posted by enilaup (U12299060) on Monday, 9th February 2009
Well how spooky is that, Monty - your messages are getting through quicker than mine - my wishes are coming true!! Your new book will certainly be on my Christmas wishlist for this year, with some more on the way to add to my collection.
Also brilliant news about the prospect of some new television projects. Please keep us informed.
Really looking forward to seeing you again this Thursday.
Take care.
PS The grass certainly hasn't grown under your feet!! -
Message 37
Posted by i_amsupernan (U13314763) on Monday, 9th February 2009
great to hear from monty my birthday in september so your new book will be a late birthday present from who evers arm i can bend .I still enjoy the gardening section in The Mail magazine on saturdays and now we have a tv programme to look forward to great
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Message 38
Posted by Trillium (U2170869) on Monday, 9th February 2009
You always described yourself as a writer first and foremost, Monty. How terrible to be snow-bound, and forced to stay at home and write
What of Fleur's photography? Any room for her to reappear alongside your writing? -
Message 39
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
Yes we take the Daily Mail on Saturdays - for the excellent 'Weekend' supplement - but really, what a ghastly 'newspaper' it is. For years we took the DM but it got more and more into celebs, women's fashion and cellulite. The supplement with MDs article and easy-to-follow TV pages, and food recipes is worth it.
The Observer in Sundays of course even if most of the supplements get dumped straight away. -
Message 40
Posted by Trillium (U2170869) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
Shame is that the Observer is getting more sensationalist each year. A quick count through always produces about 10 hyberbolic headlines:
'Fury' 'Hell' 'Crash' 'Horror' 'Meltdown' etc..
As with the Today programme much beloved by my OH, I just want them all to stop shouting and look out of the window... -
Message 41
Posted by i_amsupernan (U13314763) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
cant agree more with you paul only have the Mail for the magazine as the rest of the so called newspaper is nothing but adverts even cancelled our sunday papers now as they all seem to have gone the same way we were paying a fortune for so called free magazines but the mail mag is informative
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Message 42
Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
Monty, it is soooooo very good for the morale when you 'drop in' - please keep doing so.
Looking forward to your new books and programmes too.
Take care -
Message 43
Posted by majpayne (U12129241) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
I am new to gardening and allotments after years of working in a high tech environment and I can honestly say that you were the inspiration to me to start my wonderful new hobby and way of life. I vividly remember one shot of you just sitting done and taking the time to enjoy the view with a cup of tea under the shade of a tree after a hard days work. Thank you for all your programmes - I enjoyed them all and I savoured your knowledge and joy in what you were doing.
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Message 44
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Tuesday, 10th February 2009
But that's another reason we stopped taking the DM - shock, horror, World coming to an end.... The Observer is nice to browse through on a Sunday morning when eating a Full English and Black Pudding, followed by filter coffee. Ah!
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Message 45
Posted by Gianttrowel (U10674701) on Wednesday, 11th February 2009
Glad to here that you are well enough to come back on television Monty- fantastic - thanks for letting us know
GT -
Message 46
Posted by the cycling gardener (U2350416) on Wednesday, 11th February 2009
But that's another reason we stopped taking the DM - shock, horror, World coming to an end....Â
That's why its also known as the Daily Wail. I confess to reading it on Saturday's and Sunday's and always look forward to Monty's articles. We also take The Times. Sunday's 'Culture' magazine is an excellent TV guide by the way. -
Message 47
Posted by Trillium (U2170869) on Wednesday, 11th February 2009
GT - re our somewhat suspect choice of Sunday reading matter - don't worry, it's not contagious. And we'll paint the spare room a nice shade of blue, just for you
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Message 48
Posted by greeneddy (U6603838) on Wednesday, 11th February 2009
Monty
Good to hear you are well and writing. You've been an inspiration to many of us, and Gardener's World hasn't been the same since you left. Look forward to the book, and the TV stuff. Will be tuning in tomorrow to Question Time - birthday treat for me!
Take care
Eddy -
Message 49
Posted by Greengirl (U5195373) on Thursday, 12th February 2009
Monty,
I'm in the middle of reading your 'Jewel Garden' book & am loving it. You perfectly describe how I feel about plants, gardens & gardening - wish I could put it in words so well. Wish I had your lovely big garden too!
I look forward to your new book. -
Message 50
Posted by gardeninglynda (U4668572) on Thursday, 12th February 2009
Quite agree, I am desperate to get back out working in the garden again and so badly miss some gardening programmes in the meantime. I am so pleased that Toby has joined GW, Geoff Hamilton reincarnated, knowledgeable, practical and calming. Just waiting for that magic day in March when the air is warmer, the birds are singing and the whole garden visibly puffs its chest out!
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