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Permaculture - a revolution?

• Message 1. 

  Posted by copywrite (U3184365) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  Did anyone else see the Natural World documentary A Farm for the Future last week? If not, I highly recommend watching it on iPlayer.
  
  In summary, the programme examines how - faced with an impending oil "famine", which will bring the modern world to its knees (but here the subject is the heavily oil-reliant agriculture sector) - farmers need to radically alter the way they farm. The documentary maker, a farmer herself, met some incredible farmers/ gardeners (they define themselves in different ways - watch the programme to find out why - have come up with some revolutionary ways of producing food. The technique of food production is called Permaculture. What is perhaps even more interesting is not just HOW they produce food (no ploughing, no machinery, no pesticides) but also WHAT they produce. In short, we will be eating a lot more nuts and almost no wheat.
  
  Has anyone here adopted Permaculture and what did the rest of the community here think of the ideas the programme presented? I'd love to know as it gripped me....
  
  

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• Message 2

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  Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  Zut as they say over here .... it sounds like I missed an extremely interesting programme. Any idea if it is to be shown again? (we poor bods outside the UK are not permitted to watch programmes via iPlayer).

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• Message 3

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  Posted by copywrite (U3184365) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  Sorry Bluedoyenne, I have no idea if it will be shown again. Can I suggest you try to find out by searching online for the schedules of channels you receive. But if you are interested to find out about Permaculture there are websites in the UK and plenty of books on Amazon (I have discovered since seeing the programme).

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  Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  Thanks copywrite - quickly 'googled' the Ö÷²¥´óÐã website and found the prog .... last friday! Shall keep an eye on forthcoming schedules to see if it is repeated. And as you said, one website led to another and there is indeed a wealth of information out there about Permaculture. And the more I look, the more interesting it looks .... and definitely worth learning about.

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  Posted by alys fowler (U11197555) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  It was a fantastic programme wasn't it? I've spent all day saying 'go to iplayer, it's not one to be missed'.
  
  There are quite a few examples of forest gardens and suburban gardens run on permaculture principles. The Permaculture magazine is very good for finding out who's doing what where.
  
  I'm trying slowly to redesign my own back garden along forest garden principles (everything either has to be edible or pay back into the system, i.e using deep rooted comfrey to bring nutrients up to the surface). But I keep coming unstuck with my pretty, but faintly frivolous flowers. A daphne doesn't do much in ways of feeding me but it's so pretty that I can't bare to pull it out. Saying that I had great fun this weekend chopping down a Choisya that I didn't like to make way for a quince tree.

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  Posted by copywrite (U3184365) on Monday, 23rd February 2009

  Hi Alys,
  
  Unmissable TV indeed. Fascinated to read you are working on a project of this nature. Have you relied upon just the magazine or do you recommend any books you have found useful? There are even courses to join.
  
  I sympathize with not wanting to remove beautiful plants. I felt a revolutionary ripple pass through me as I watched this programme (not many TV programmes can make you feel like that ) but then I wanted to calm down as I felt radical changes and strict rules like the pay back into the system or being edible rule would seriously challenge my love of aesthetic gardens. Unless of course, we can learn a new way to appreciate edible plants that are also beautiful. How radical have you become? I seem to remember you have something of a town garden. Mine is a typical suburban garden and a forest in this scale would seem pretty silly.

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• Message 7

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  Posted by janetclaire (U3311015) on Tuesday, 24th February 2009

  hi - i missed it on friday, but watched it last night on the iplayer. it was fascinating, i hadn't really thought about the fact that no oil would change farming, you just assume somehow an alternative would be found.
  interesting to see how continual ploughing of fields drains them so much, very thought provoking programme
  
  

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• Message 8

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  Posted by copywrite (U3184365) on Tuesday, 24th February 2009

  Hi Janetclaire,
  
  On the subject of ploughing, I seem to remember a report recently hitting the headlines about how much of the UK's soil is biologically dead. That's why farmers need synthetic fertilizers. What a dreadful thought. To me, it suggests that if farmers can (under the pressure of boosting yields as populations rise and climate change poses major challenges) they should do what fishermen have been forced to do and lay off some areas to help it recover.
  
  Hi Alys - sorry - my question about a Permaculture book might have led you into dangerous territory given that as a Ö÷²¥´óÐã employee you probably can't be seen to recommend a book. So don't do it! I did have a look at the magazine portal though. They recommend and sell a lot of books. I feel a purchase coming on!

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• Message 9

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  Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Tuesday, 24th February 2009

  Good to hear from you Alys!
  
  Maybe you could do a permaculture garden on GW? Personally I think this would be a great idea and it may strike a chord with many gardeners looking for a more sustainable way of growing things (and by 'things' I also include your daphne - may not be much use nutritionally, but it does feed the soul)

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• Message 10

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  Posted by Aspidistra (U11680993) on Wednesday, 25th February 2009

  Yes, that would be good, wouldn't it? A part of GW about permaculture? Its got your name on it, Alys!

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• Message 11

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  Posted by copywrite (U3184365) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  Personally, I think it would be a step in the wrong direction for GW. Can you imagine the uproar (especially on these boards!)?
  
  Permaculture is primarily about food production and farmers are the main audience for this, as well as those serious about food production and environmental protection. Really, I think all those interested in it should get hold of books and magazines on the subject or attend a course and let GW help gardeners of all abilities. And I say that as someone who would love to see it on TV. Just not GW.

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• Message 12

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  Posted by Aspidistra (U11680993) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  I think you are missing a major point about permaculture, Copywrite. It is NOT just about 'food production and farmers' by any means, it is about an integrated system that we can all take at least parts of for use in our gardens, which is, um, dare I use that word...sustainable.
  
  I think maybe you should get hold of the books and magazines so you are properly informed about it.
  
  GW, oh here we go, GW desperately needs to bring alternative ideas into gardening, surely?

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• Message 13

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  Posted by Bluedoyenne (U2341157) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  I don't wish to appear contradictory copywrite, but I think GW is the perfect vehicle for such a subject. I'll go further and say that GW might even attract a new, young and more environmentally-connected audience if it did embrace the question of environmental sustainability head on. And a trial garden based on Permaculture might just be what the doctor ordered

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• Message 14

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  Posted by Lesarladais (U13848440) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  Hi everyone, including anyone at Ö÷²¥´óÐã Gardening!
  Living outside the UK, we happened on this superb programme by chance last Friday and have spent the last few days trying to obtain all the information possible.
  We have been looking for inspiration for some time for our "gardening" projects and have now found it! We have a few hectares of land - small fruit orchard, small vineyard, walnut orchard, figs, peaches, etc., plus meadow land (cut once a year by local farmer) and woodlands left to their devices. We are already quite "natural" but are now determined to go towards a permaculture solution.
  Any ideas, advice, help would be welcome. Perhaps the Ö÷²¥´óÐã would like to create their permaculture garden here - we need to learn fast!!
  One small "problem" - we are in SW France, the Perigord Noir, near Sarlat, so the climate is a little different from the average found in the UK.
  

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• Message 15

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  Posted by Aspidistra (U11680993) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  Permaculture was started in Australia and has quite a big following there in the organic community. For directions into it try www. permculture.org.

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• Message 16

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  Posted by greeneddy (U6603838) on Thursday, 26th February 2009

  Ping

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• Message 17

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  Posted by brawn (U13850161) on Saturday, 7th March 2009

  bump - DON'T MISS THIS LAST CHANCE TO SEE on iPlayer for a couple of days! Way to go!

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• Message 18

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  Posted by Aspidistra (U11680993) on Saturday, 7th March 2009

  Thanks for the reminder - just watched it. I thought the bit at the end about using small plots and relating it to people who would define themselves as gardeners rather than farmers was interesting.
  
  I have been concerned about artificial fertilisers for some time - I don't know what they are actually made of, which in itself worries me and the programme confirms my suspicion that the fossil fuels for producing them make them a no-no. I think a lot of people think that to be a 'proper' gardener you have to use fertilisers - I think you can get a perfectly decent yeald without, if you care for the soil.
  
  
  

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