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It's an age thing!
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Message 1.Â
Posted by poshHebeJeebie (U9319867) on Tuesday, 17th May 2011
I've read the many threads about GW. With some, I've agreed. With others I have had my doubts. But . . .
I have stopped to think about it. When I was (a bit!) younger, and gardening was a new experience, I absorbed the information on TV avidly. Geoff Hamilton was a gardening hero. I also loved Geoffrey Smith, whose programmes inspired me.
So, here I am, somewhat longer in the tooth and with many years of gardening experience behind me, I've had my triumphs and disasters and learnt by experience as well as from GW, for which I was a devoted viewer.
But it doesn't tick all the boxes any more. I was irritated by the silliness of the last couple of years, even though Toby Buckland was a nice enough character on the screen. Monty has never been my particular favourite - but he is knowledgable, and tries to inform and inspire.
On a very personal level, I have loved Carol Klein - her series from her own garden was truly inspirational for me.
And that's the point, really - "for me". Not your average viewer. Not someone trying to learn the basics - but an experienced gardener, wanting to be entertained and to re-discover some gardening techniques (but not actually needing to).
So when I've been critical of Monty, I apologise. I may dip in and out of GW from time to time. But I recognise that I am not the target audience. Tempus fugit and all that. (For Archers' devotees, they will identify with the "not the right kind of listener" argument here
).
I have learnt a lot from GW in the past. I hope that newer gardeners will learn and be enthused in the future.
I retire gracefully (well, I will try to at least) to the margins.
PHJ -
Message 2
Posted by crouchee (U13371975) on Tuesday, 17th May 2011
I reckon that's about my take on the subject too.
Why is there a feeling that GW should be about teaching beginners to garden anyway? Can it not be just about the many different ways that we enjoy gardening in this country in it's many forms?
Top Gear doesn't feel it has to teach us how to drive? -
Message 3
Posted by poshHebeJeebie (U9319867) on Tuesday, 17th May 2011
Hello Crouchee.
If I remember correctly, you're not a million miles away from me in Somerset? Blessed as this area is with a benign climate and fertile soil, I reckon we've got it pretty easy, overall! But even the SW could do with some useful rain atm.
I like your analogy about Top Gear not teaching people to drive etc. But I did feel that, at one time, GW was a programme that, if it didn't teach, as such, was a good vehicle for current information and gardening techniques. I got a lot out of it in the past, and I would hope that current and future generations would, too.
PHJ -
Message 4
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Wednesday, 18th May 2011
You put your point very well, PHJ.
I suppose the same goes for me (particularly your words about Carol's series). The only difference being, my gardening days started before Geoff Hamilton. -
Message 5
Posted by poshHebeJeebie (U9319867) on Wednesday, 18th May 2011
Oh, David - I, too, recall the earlier days of GW. But it was GH who really had the ability to communicate beyond the TV screen, if you know what I mean!
I know you were irritated, with justification, about some of the dismissive SP comments by Monty. But perhaps this is where you and I and others of a certain generation need to back off a bit?
Was all the information from previous GW presenters 100% accurate? Did we know any different in them there far off days? Have we learnt basics from TV and books and, most importantly, modified those basics from year on year experience?
I'm not sure exactly what I'm trying to get across here: perhaps it's just that we older gardeners have to take the occasional step back and let others go on their own personal journeys of discovery. Slightly misleading information is none too helpful, I grant you - but it's not critical. And in a few years, there will be more people trying to grow their own (be they SPs or lettuces or whatever) and learning to a certain extent by trial and error.
I hope they are enthused by the current GW. I hope, hope, hope that Carol pops up again with another informative series. I hope to carry on gardening for many years to come - and to enjoy it as much as I have done for many a long year!
PHJ -
Message 6
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Oh, David -I know you were irritated, with justification, about some of the dismissive SP comments by Monty. But perhaps this is where you and I and others of a certain generation need to back off a bit?Â
PHJ - No, it isn't just about his comments about sweet peas that irritates me (and to be honest it isn’t the only comments/advice I’ve taken issue with) I just think that when assuming the mantel of the nations gardener they should be more careful in what they say and advise.
Monty said that Spencer sweet peas lack scent, well according to The National Sweet Pea Society they are designated as being highly scented. Many top sweet pea growers such as Derek Heathcote (owner of Eagle Sweet Peas) were infuriated by this, it has a detrimental affect on sales…some call it the Delia affect.
The only presenter I have totally trusted since Alan T, is Carol Klein…no gaps in her horticultural knowledge whatsoever. -
Message 7
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Oh dear - I wonder if it's time to lay the sweet pea affront to rest
Shall we move on a bit? -
Message 8
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Oh dear - I wonder if it's time to lay the sweet pea affront to rest
Shall we move on a bit? nooj - if you're referring to me, you obviously didn’t read my message very well and of course I was replying to PHJ.
We know he motioned you once on GW & you have been ga ga ever since, but you need to come to terms with the fact that not everyone views him through rose tinted glasses and he does talk twaddle sometimes. -
Message 9
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Now THAT is insulting David.
A personal insult would normally mean I could press the whatit and complain - but I think I'll let it stand for others to see. -
Message 10
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Now THAT is insulting David.
A personal insult would normally mean I could press the whatit and complain - but I think I'll let it stand for others to see.Â
nooj - please feel free to complain if you wish, myself I can't see anything that is untrue or in breach of the house rules.
We've both been around for a long time and for what it is worth, I hold you in high regard.
Unfortunately, if you keep pecking away at someone, sooner or later you will get a reaction. -
Message 11
Posted by Lottie (U2331125) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
I'm really shocked at you David K, never in all the years I've been reading your posts here have I ever known you to be insulting to a lady. We all know that Nooj is one of Montys biggest fans but she is certainly not 'gaga' in any way shape or form. I think you owe Nooj an apology!
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Message 12
Posted by Lottie (U2331125) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Oh dear! Did I say something wrong?
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Message 13
Posted by Mycowaz (U14848091) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Blimey your all so naughty....what's been going on?? -
Message 14
Posted by nooj (U13729031) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Goodness knows!?!
Lottie you didn't say anything wrong at all -
Message 15
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Just in case anyone thinks I got trigger happy all of a sudden, the only person I have ever made a complaint about was Grid....and don't intend to change my ways now,
Nooj, sorry!
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Message 16
Posted by poshHebeJeebie (U9319867) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Oh dear! I didn't want to start a thread that caused dissention and problems. I read it earlier this evening, and didn't expect to see a number of posts modded. A bit hard-hitting they may have been - but not really moddable. (Certainly not when you can remember the dreaded Grid to whom you refer David - now that was a menace, who was so often "overlooked" that one wondered if the board had any mods on duty at times!)
I hadn't thought about the implications of comments from GW presenters having the "Delia" effect - but I'm sure you're right, and it behoves all those on the TV, especially on a flagship programme like GW, to be extra careful with the chosen words/recommendations etc.
PHJ -
Message 17
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
I hadn't thought about the implications of comments from GW presenters having the "Delia" effect - but I'm sure you're right, and it behoves all those on the TV, especially on a flagship programme like GW, to be extra careful with the chosen words/recommendations etc.
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PHJ - you only have to look at the faithful gathered around him at the shows, hanging on to his every word, to understand the potential damage he can do.
I've spoken to the owner of Eagle Sweet Peas on the subject, and it was him who informed me of the detrimental affect on sales. -
Message 18
Posted by poshHebeJeebie (U9319867) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Now that's a shame, David, and I'm really sorry for Eagle Seeds. I would like to think that there is a wide audience for your SP musings/advice, but clearly not as potent as TV.
(Btw - I wasn't able to sow SPs las autumn, but the early spring sowings are doing very well, and I have high hopes, drought & water restrictions notwithstanding!)
At least it's Chelsea next week, so there will be TV overload, with coverage every day. But at least that's a feast for the eye (and not a withered box hedge in sight)
PHJ -
Message 19
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Thursday, 19th May 2011
Nothing wrong with spring sowing of SPs, PHJ, you just have to expect later flowers... I'm cutting them quite freely now.
Of course, those who grow them for exhibition need them from mid-June at the latest.
I've never been (or wished to go) to Chelsea, it's all a bit divorced from reality for me. -
Message 20
Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Friday, 20th May 2011
Grid is still with us in a very "clear" disguise.
Chelsea in the flesh is a very different thing from Chelsea on TV and Chelsea now is a vast improvment on the crush of 20 years ago before they restricted numbers. The gardens are better too.
I don't think it's fair to dismiss it as being divorced from reality if you've never been. There's all sorts of stuff they don't show on TV and it's a fabulous opportunity to see plants, new and old, at their very best and talk to the nurserymen and women about their cultivation.
You can't buy plants, except at closing on Saturday, but you can order plants you've seen at their best, buy seeds and all manner of gardening clothing and equipment from mini trowels to mega mowers, gazebos and greenhouses, wind chimes to obelisks and pergolas with every kind of ornament in between. Oh, and all manner of water features too.
It's a brilliant day out and doesn't have to be a spend fest unless you want it to. -
Message 21
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Friday, 20th May 2011
Obbs - I will admit I do draw my opinion from TV coverage, so perhaps don’t do it justice. However stainless steel & plastic gardens have never impressed me and I groan at the sight of those crowds.
Shrewsbury is much more my kind of show. -
Message 22
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Friday, 20th May 2011
Glad you think the same Obs, I thought I could "Clearly" read his thoughts on a "daily " basis...............
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Message 23
Posted by Obelixx (U2157162) on Friday, 20th May 2011
DK - Most of the gardens are not plastic and steel and it pays to examine the planting combinations which are far more realistic now than 20 years ago when they'd have daffs and rhodos and poppies all flowering at once. The hard landscaping in some show gardens is clearly beyond the means most of us but inspiration can still be drawn for verticlas, vistas, walkways and so on.
If you get there at the start of the day there are no crowds so the gardens can easly be seen. By midday it's getting busy and then there's a bit of a crush after 3pm or so when the half day ticketers arrive. By then I've usually seen all teh gardens and the floral marquee and can potter about chatting with friends over a Pimms or go and see what's on offer from product suppliers before leaving around 5 or 6pm.
I've been to Malvern, Hampton and Tatton and enjoyed them all immensely but Chelsea is in a league of its own.
Lowena - we are not alone. -
Message 24
Posted by Lowena (U14575314) on Friday, 20th May 2011
I agree with Obelixx. Chelsea is well worth going to - it has improved immensley over the last few years. It is not the same on tv - well worth the money and effort
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Message 25
Posted by David K (U14115317) on Friday, 20th May 2011
Pleased to see the modded posts reinstated,
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Message 26
Posted by thedogcody (U14659366) on Friday, 20th May 2011
Glad you think the same Obs, I thought I could "Clearly" read his thoughts on a "daily " basis............... Before I read this I was reading a reply on" grow you own"- when I went back a few moments ago this post and all previous posts have been removed- I think this refers to the person you hinted at.
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