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Katie:  Hello and welcome to Adapt The World which is all about learning how we can make the world more accessible and inclusive for disabled people. I'm Katie from Radio 1’s Life Hacks and I'm joined by my hilariously inspirational co-host, India Sasha. I think hilariously inspirational is a great way to be described.  

India: I'm completely soaking that up. 

Katie: Hilarious and inspirational in one. 

India: Thank you very much. But yes, as you heard there, I'm India, and I'm a 22 year old content creator from Belfast. I have a condition called Symbrachydactyly. Which means I was born with no fingers on my left hand and I want to change the way the world sees disabilities. So that's why I took to TikTok to show people not to be afraid to fully embrace just who they are. And joining us on the show today is parasport athlete and world record breaker, Maria Lyle. At the age of 14, she set a world record in the 200 metre sprint. A record she has since broken on several occasions. Hello, Maria, how are you?

Maria: Hiya, I'm good. Thank you very much for having me on.

Katie: Thank you so much for joining us. We're so pleased to have you here. So you started running at nine years old. Tell us how you got into the sport.

Maria: Well, it was actually through my mum. So my mum was my PE teacher at primary school when I was younger. So I’ve got cerebral palsy and like simple things like walking and playing in the playground was a real challenge for me. Like I was always falling over and stuff. And I was about eight or nine. And we had to do this bleep test…

Katie: God that's given me… The bleep test, ah!

Maria: Now I'm a sprinter, I'm like nah I can't do that. So we had to do that. And I was a bit all, ‘I don't know about this’. But I did actually manage to beat all my classmates and that was like, that was the first time I'd ever felt that feeling of achievement. Because I was always kind of, the teachers were always quite dismissive, or I felt like I was never as good as everyone else. And my parents thought this could be a good way of kind of managing my cerebral palsy getting my legs a wee bit stronger. So I’d go out on runs with my mum and my dad and I joined a local running club. I've never really at that point, never really viewed myself as disabled. And I'm from a small town and so I was like, the only one with a physical disability. And we kind of my mum had found out about the Paralympics and kind of got me trying to, like different Paralympic sports go into different events and kinda just got picked up there from a young age.

Katie: That's amazing and that sense of achievement that you mentioned there, you know, that must have just felt so great to be like, oh my goodness I've beaten all my classmates here.

Maria: Yeah, I think yeah, it was just looked down upon by like, I find things like maths and English a little bit more challenging, not because of, I didn't understand that just with my cerebral palsy, I struggle with fatigue. And so I'd get tired or slower at doing my work. And writing was a challenge. And I think people just thought I was stupid. So I was always kind of written off. And so to actually kind of excel something was, I'd never felt that before.

India: And has your cerebral palsy ever limited your performance significantly, in any sort of way that you can remember?

Maria: I wouldn't say it limited me. There's days where it's a little bit worse than usual, sometimes, like with muscle tone and stuff. And so, my mobility isn't as good. But like, I definitely have to work a lot harder at things but I wouldn't say it was like a limitation. You can let it hold you back and stuff and and the past I've had like, it's affected my mental health. But I kind of just like I'm always getting my parents have always just been like, I'll just get on with it. I'll never I was never like, wrapped up in cotton wool. I was just like just get on with it. And I guess that's all you can do.

Katie: Yeah, that's amazing. Let's get into the three things that you would change about the world if we were to rebuild it tomorrow and make it a better place for disabled people. What's your first one, Maria?

Maria: So I was thinking of this, it's quite challenging, because it's probably a load different things

Katie: It's a pretty big question isn't it, what would you change about the world? We're not exactly making it easy for everyone. 

Maria: I'll start off on a more serious kind of note, I think, definitely within the workplace or like schools or universities. I know for myself, like, even just like getting into work or uni and stuff. That's a challenge itself. It's tiring and there's lots of different things that maybe disabled people need to consider that other people don't have to and Like, I feel like what like the workplace is that they need to be able to adjust then be open to kind of how, how we can make adaptations to best help people with disabilities count. How can we make a better quality of life for them, so they're not like struggling and being tired all the time, because I guess things have gotten a bit better now that we can work from home and stuff. But it's still challenging, I think, if you're not having to consider managing, like fatigue and stuff like that. You're probably you've never, you're not going to think about all sorts or from the office who's got this? Yeah, then maybe need an extra half an hour break or that? So I think yeah, then that needs to be changed.

Katie: Can you tell us about any experiences that you've had in the workplace that have made you think this needs to change and things need to be made easier for disabled people when they're working?

Maria: Yeah, when I finished school I did an apprenticeship at the Scottish Parliament and actually had like, it was a full time placement. And I found it really tiring. So it was like the outside, I did eight to four, you could do eight to four or nine to five. I did eight to four and it was like a half an hour lunch break. And I think like just that constant like that there were no breaks in between, you're like you could get up from your desk and have a wee walk about, but like I was exhausted, like I was like, oh, I need to go to the toilet. And I was just like, oh, like, I have a wee five minutes sleep on the toilet. Like, then I had to go part time because I was struggling with the hours. And then it kind of got me thinking like, what, what do I do about like, one because I want to try and have full time hours and stuff because obviously that affects your pay. But then how like, what can workplaces do to allow you to make sure you can do that? Because it’s not that I'm choosing to be like. I'm going to my bed early. I'm not being like out all night and doing that. It's just that's my disability. And there's nothing I can do about that. And I think yeah, I think workplaces need to be mindful of what can we do. 

India: And what about your second thing? What other thing would you change about the world?

Maria:

So I've been single for four or five months. And I've joined Tinder and it's been a bit of an experience. So I like so in my bio, I always like Scottish lass with dodgy legs. And, and it's just some of the comments like, within, like the first a couple of messages I was all of a sudden I've got this disability and that if it's an issue, it's fine. And some most people are alright, some of the comments are really weird like ‘alright, effed up legs’ or ‘that wasn't in your bio, you should have told me that it should be in your bio that you're disabled’. And just you'll get other inappropriate comments. I like a bit of dark humour, but I wouldn't say that to a stranger, or you wouldn't go up to somebody on the street and say something like about the disability if you didn't know them. So I think people need to realise what things aren't appropriate and things are appropriate. And just kind of a reminder just because you can say that online. Like, because you can hide behind a screen. Like you wouldn't dare to say that somebody's like to their face.

Katie: I think you know, I hear stories from some of my friends who are on dating apps and it sounds like they can be a pretty wild place for that kind of thing for sort of inappropriate comments being sent and people just thinking they can say whatever they want. And I'd never thought of it before from the perspective of somebody with a disability but 

India: Oh, it's so bad.

Katie: Like is it something you've come across with? Are there barriers when it comes to dating as a disabled person?

India: You think to yourself right first of all, am I gonna let people know from the outset or am I gonna wait until I get to know them more? It is kind of this like touch and go…  What am I when am I gonna mention it, how do I mention it? Or will I leave it until they see me or once they see me, are they gonna leave? It's like all these and I feel like it's something that's just not really talked about, like the dating experience of people with disabilities kind of just in the in the normal world, you know, on Tinder and on Instagram, even just DMs and stuff and I find that it's sort of easier whenever you've got your disability kind of insight whenever you can see it, but for the likes of obviously you literally you talk about on your TikTok and stuff, it's not always obvious that you have a disability, it's not visible. Yeah, so it's really difficult and even, maybe talking about it more and I know it is kind of one of those awkward subjects to talk about. But maybe that's something that could potentially help change that just kind of talking about the dating life of everyday people with disabilities.

Katie: What's the third thing that you would change about the world Maria?

Maria: The third thing, I think, probably is a little bit of humour. I guess it's fairly personal of how people want to deal or talk about their disability. But I think having like, probably more open honest conversations, because then we can learn about like, people's experiences, what we can do to best support people. And I think it's like, if you're a little bit uncomfortable, just asking somebody, a bit about their disability or something and I'm pretty sure most people would be fine. And you'd probably realise that we're just normal people just like everyone else. So we've got goals and like, didn't miss this and that, and it's not, it doesn't really affect the person you are. I think so, it's a hard one, yeah.

Katie: So you'd basically like people to treat disabled people like everybody else and sort of, like, ask you about it and not be shy to, it’s something that's come up a few times while we've been having these discussions. Perhaps people don't, if people avoid people with disabilities, and maybe don't ask them about it.

India: They're happy to stare, but they'll never ask you the question like, yeah, just generally, I'd have you can always tell whenever somebody's asked me a question about your disability, out of genuine interest, or you know, if they're trying to be not the nicest type. And really, I feel like it's really obvious whenever somebody is genuinely just interested and trying to just ask you an honest question.

Maria: Again, because when we've been away, say like the Paralympics and stuff is fairly split, we like to joke with each other a bit about it. And it's quite funny. But then there's some people that are very uncomfortable about speaking about their disability and you wonder if it's because they've had people make comments and bad reactions and stuff. If it was more open discussions about it, especially with kids, like you're learning about it, I think there's going to be less of an uncomfortable subject. I don't know if there's just something like, a lot of the time, there's nothing you can do to change it, it's who you are.

Katie: I think that's a really good point you made about you know, there's so much diversity within the world of people with disabilities. Like, that's something that I've certainly learned from doing these podcasts, like no two experiences of a disabled person are the same. And there's such a range of different disabilities and also just your experiences, even if you have the exact same disability as somebody else is going to be completely different. And some people like you say, will want to talk about it, some people won't. Some people will want to use humour, some people won't. So it's just about being compassionate and being mindful of different people and what their needs are and what they're comfortable with.

India: Maria, thank you so much for being on the podcast. I've really enjoyed hearing from you and all your like individual life experiences. It's just great to hear the kind of things that you have and it's just amazing. So thank you so much for coming on, and speaking to us. And thank you so much for hitting play on this episode. We've got more amazing chats for you to listen to you right now. Head over to the Ö÷²¥´óÐã Sounds app and search for Adapt The World. See you later!