Ö÷²¥´óÐã

Some real legendary classics here. Of course, we would rather see "classic" races from 2010 rather than the dull boring Gilles Villeneuve for example sliding his Ferrari around in the wet at Imola 1981.

Respect for Alguersuari has greatly risen - an interesting array of choices, mixing entertainment and his own personal achievements - and different from the usual suspects!
Hooray!

I'm not sure that is his twitter account..

1. At 11:13 20th Jul 2011, Senna27 wrote:
Some real legendary classics here. Of course, we would rather see "classic" races from 2010 rather than the dull boring Gilles Villeneuve for example sliding his Ferrari around in the wet at Imola 1981.

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It doesn't matter what "we" (read: you) would rather see. This is Alguersuari's list.

When you make it as an F1 driver, you can post your own choices.

"This is the first time we have shown highlights of that Japanese race"

Oof, I think we hurt some feelings, guys...

#4 does alg pay for a tv license? Does Alg know more about classic F1 races than Patrick Head, Peter Sauber, Ron Dennis or my humble self? Is the format for classic f1 inherently restricted to the races what these kids can remember? Answers on a postcard.

#3 - believe it or not, it is his actual twitter account. Yes its a bit random, but at least its a bit of a variation from other F1 drivers (Mark Webber aka @aussiegrit the exception).

Senna27 - yes we'd rather see Villeneuve at Imola '81 but i'd rather have this feature in the current format than the prospect of losing this feature entirely when the axe swings on Ö÷²¥´óÐãF1. Be grateful for what you DO get i say.

whoops, I forgot, Alguersuari's twitter is "@AlguersuariJA", i wasn't paying attention ;)

I knew people would complain, always happens. He's entitled to choose whatever 5 races he likes. So what if some of them aren't what you would term classics, but they're important to him and that's why he's chosen them. Hungary 09 and Malaysia 10 I can understand for the reasons he said, nothing wrong with choosing Australia 10 as it's not like it was a terrible race, Europe 07 was a crazy race, and Japan 06 wasn't exactly a terrible race either. Honestly I swear people think that all the drivers should choose races from the 60s/70s/80s. Get over yourselves, stop complaining, it's their choice, and if you have a problem with it, well it's just tough luck really. The drivers are under NO obligation to choose races from decades, eras, seasons or whatever that you guys want. They can choose whatever races they like. If you don't like it, tough. Not every driver is going to choose 5 classic races from 30 odd years ago just to please you guys. They've made their choices, respect it, and if you can't, it's your problem, the driver is't going to care, as they're his choices. Sorry to seem so blunt, but I just fail to understand why people act as though they think all classic races chosen by drivers should be from a long time ago just so they can see some old footage. It's the drivers choice. Deal with it.

Senna27: you come on here every single week whinging about this - if you really hate it so much why do you persist? It was explained at the beginning of the season that the format was changing. Just how many times do you think the rest of us need to hear about the races you think we should be watching from the past each week. Your arrogance in mentioning yourself in the same breath as Head, Sauber and Dennis is absurd. I'd rather read about the races someone in F1 considers classics than you.

You could simply go on Youtube and look at different races to your hearts content. How many times do others need to point out the format, and the fact that there are a finite number of races to pick from.

Good choices Jaime - almost as good as his recent race activity!

As usual there is some artistic interpretting going on here from Mr Benson.

But at least there are some quotes though from Jamie which goes a little to explaining his choices. Much better than some of the previous lists in which there were little to no quotes from the drivers to explain their choices.

@11 Eric Morecambe - Wise words.

;)

Senna27, I think you're being a bit hard on Jaime, but on the other hand, what an excellent suggestion to get nominations from team principals and the like. I love the idea. Granted, Ron Dennis isn't an F1 principal any longer, but he (and Flavio Briatore, Frank Williams and Ann Bradshaw) would I'm sure come up with some inspired classic F1 suggestions. Make it happen please!!!

Murray Walkerrrr. :D

Senna27, you've had this argument out with many others including myself over the course of the season. Doubtless you'll have it again. I can only echo the comments of the others who've already posted - if you don't like it, just go elsewhere and find what you do like.

I'll happily concede that in my book as well as yours these aren't the best races of all time, but then I'm not going to whinge about them either as 'they aren't my choices'. May I suggest for the next classic f1 feature you either say something positive, or nothing at all?

Andrew, one thing we all have in common on this board, whether critical or not, is that we all love Classic F1.

How's about keeping the same format next year, but asking other F1 employees, Eg, Team Managers, designers, mechanics..etc. If there choices fit, we may get races from further back that the modern drivers haven['t thought of.

For me, the race doesn't even have to be that much of a classic, i just love the coverage, the way the cars look, the crowds, the circuits, the apparent lack of safety (mechanics in an over crowded pit lane in shorts and T-Shirts), Murrays commentary. Its all great stuff.

Anyway, just an idea.

Hmmm like it or lump it they say - how smart is that for a forum! No that philosophy doesnt fit well with me in the supposed free world. The fact is there are 100s of classic races that the Ö÷²¥´óÐã have not shown out of ignorance or laziness. The current format is restricted predominantly to races over the last couple of years...if you open your eyes GP races stretch back a little further than what the xbox generation can remember. It's like asking a 5 year old for their best travel destinations or a Stevie Wonder for his favourite painting. Was a poor format and still is. Lucky we had Nico with the 1985 SA GP and Rubens with Monza 1978 otherwise the choices have been predictable and one dimensional.

and for the ripest plum, dont forget Massa and Alonso coming together before the podium.


some choice words by the little brazilian there :)

Senna27, no offence, but you're talking rubbish. They haven't shown them out of ignorance or laziness? Stop talking trash. Honestly all you do is whinge whinge whinge, wah wah wah. You don't like the format? You don't like the fact they haven't shown races from when YOU want them to be from? Well tough luck, this isn't the senna27 classic races thread where you decide what races they show. You don't like what they show? Tough. Don't come here then. Don't watch them. But don't go whinging like you always do. I swear if a driver chose 5 races from the 60s/70s/80s you'll STILL find a reason to whinge by saying "oh they're not classics" or "they're not the races I wanted to see". Grow up and get over yourself. You clearly have nothing better to do than whinge every single time. Get a grip, and get a life.

Stevvy1986 one can only hope 1986 doesn't represent your year of birth because the future is looking pretty dark if your technique in discussion is anything to go by. Now rather than "swearing" with anger and frustration why not attempt to counteract my points with substance?

Senna27 - their choices are no less predictable than your regular postings on here. Their's however have the merit of being rather more interesting than your "contributions".

Hardly an inspired choice of races. Did he not know there was racing before 2006!! If drivers are only going to remember races from when they got out of nappies this idea falls flat.

#24 There is no rule saying he can't pick races he was involved in. Other drivers have had a mixture of older and newer races, and one or two went for older races. Why don't look at the entirety of the races picked so far, rather than simply focus on these five in order to make a point that isn't really worth making.

Yes it does Senna27, the future isn't looking pretty dark (not sure who you think you are trying to have a go at me based on age and trying to talk about the future being pretty dark, pretty poor from you, no need for it when you know nothing about me), and there's little point in counteracting your points, because with comments like "they haven't shown older races out of ignorance and laziness" you have no actual point to counteract in the first place. All you're doing is complaining. You haven't made any actual point, you've just moaned about the fact the drivers don't choose races that YOU want to watch. As I said, get over yourself, and stop complaining. Some of your comments are a combination of sarcastic and childish. You haven't made a point, and you haven't even given any better suggestions, it's just "wah wah wah I don't like these choices why aren't they showing older races that I want to see", which is basically the same thing you say every single time. This is about the drivers choices. Not yours. Don't go whinging just because the drivers aren't choosing races you want to see. Like I said before, you'd probably find a reason to complain even if every driver chose 5 races from the era/decade/season you want them to choose from. You really don't seem to understand that these are the drivers choices, they can choose any races they want, and you have no influence on what they choose. Don't like their choices? Rather than complaining, go search out the races you want to see anyway, I've no doubt there'll be footage somewhere or other on the internet to satisfy you, then you don't have to come here and whinge every single time about drivers not choosing races that you want to see. You're like a broken record, we all know what's coming every time a driver chooses.

Yes why didn't JA pick that classic from 1981? Was it because he was -8 1/2 years old? Did he spend his youth buzzing around in karts rather than soaking up the whole F1 history to keep Senna27 happy? Shame on Mr & Mrs Alguersuari....

1. At 11:13 20th Jul 2011, Senna27 wrote: "Some real legendary classics here. Of course, we would rather see "classic" races from 2010 rather than the dull boring Gilles Villeneuve for example sliding his Ferrari around in the wet at Imola 1981."

Harsh.

8. at 12:02 20th Jul 2011, swrcsky wrote: "...i'd rather have this feature in the current format than the prospect of losing this feature entirely when the axe swings on Ö÷²¥´óÐãF1."

Frankly I'd be quite content to sacrifice this feature right now if it meant keeping F1 off Dirty Desmond's Channel 5. How many ads for bog roll supplement the Daily Star can any human stomach in a two and a half hour period? Let's find out...

Being grateful for what you have now might mean ending up with something a lot worse later. There's quite a lot of froth in the Ö÷²¥´óÐã's coverage that's nice to have, but which we can live without. Savings can be found towards feeding Bernie's insatiable appetite, I'm sure. (But don't mention the Germans...)

Ö÷²¥´óÐã should have asked the drivers "Pick 5 races of your choice just as long as at least one of them is from between 1979 and 1996 so we can show extended highlights of it" to make everyone happy. ;-)

@Senna27 whether or not you like the format, absolutely nobody gives the tiniest damn. It's not going to change because some sad internet whinger thinks it should, so why come on complaining every week. That's the format, watch it if you want, don't watch it if you don't want to. The vast majority of people really enjoy it, so that's what goes.

One is not portioning the blame on the drivers, rather the format decided upon by the Ö÷²¥´óÐã. Before you retort with "Be happy with what you get" proletarian rhetoric, the Ö÷²¥´óÐã is as much mine as it is Mr Bensons. The Ö÷²¥´óÐã have fortunately acquired the rights for broadcasting archive races, my view is to use it to the full rather than placing needless restrictions. And those that say all of the classics have already been shown, I seriously question your grasp of GP history. Fire away kids!

Senna27's heart is in the right place.

Simply put this is a waste of the format. With it almost certain the Ö÷²¥´óÐã won't renew the rights, we have a limited number of years to see as much of the wonderful Ö÷²¥´óÐã archive as possible.

The suggestion to adjust this for next season to use people who've been in Formula 1 longer is the right one. Speak to ex drivers and team members. They will have more interesting choices.

There are still many many amazing races from 1979-1996 which have not been covered.

senna27

"the Ö÷²¥´óÐã is as much mine as it is Mr Bensons."

ARE YOU GONNA TAKE THAT ANDREW!!!!!!!!!!!??

31. At 14:20 20th Jul 2011, Senna27 wrote:
The Ö÷²¥´óÐã have fortunately acquired the rights for broadcasting archive races, my view is to use it to the full rather than placing needless restrictions.

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They aren't needless restrictions. The drivers pick their favourite races - it is a format, not a restriction. It doesn't say they have to involve the driver, either - so they are well within their rights to pick races from the 80's. But Alguersuari didn't, and he is entirely within his rights not to.

That format has been chosen to first give some context and narrative to each of the races, to give us some insight into the personalities of the drivers, and to give us a bit of their history in the sport.

Some of the choices may seem repetitive, but complaining that the driver has picked some races you don't want to see, in a blog where the format is that the driver picks the races, just seems a bit daft.

Hello Andrew hello everyone. I don't want to seem ungrateful for your work Andrew on this blog. But I have to agree on some of Senna27 comments. This year format on classic formula 1 races has sometimes been poor. Of what I seen so far this year people meaning of classic is far different from mine.

Will F1 be on the Ö÷²¥´óÐã next season? There are a lot of rumours that the Beeb are dumping it to save money and that it will be on Channel 4 or 5 next year.

Senna27 is a complete and utter fool. Im sure i have seen such classics that Senna27 is referring to only a few races back. I have seen races from the 70's and 80's so i do not know where Senna27 is getting this from. Why he is moaning about the format, god knows. Thanks god there is a format we never used to be able to watch these in the build up to a grand prix weekend. If you want to watch all the classics over and over again, i suggest you buy the dvd's or videos or even watch on youtube or whatever. there's no point in you arguing with everyone on here because it isnt going to change a single thing.

On a complete side note, the three 2010 selections do actually provide an interesting story, as both Australia and Malaysia 2010 show Alonso being held up behind Massa. These provide an interesting precursor to the team orders in Germany 2010, and do actually show that Ferrari were unwilling to move Massa out of the way of the quicker Alonso early in the season - only doing so when Massa's championship hopes were extremely slim.

Dear Andrew,

Classic F1 is great. The only thing is that we cannot have access to the highlights... which is annoying.

You should be glad the Ö÷²¥´óÐã let's a lot of you guys have a comment section to run your mouth on. Statements like "does alg pay for a tv license?" are pathetic. This season's feature is favourite F1 races of the drivers. Next season I'm sure they'll change stuff around. You're the same people who say that the Ö÷²¥´óÐã F1 TV coverage is rubbish when it is clearly miles better than anything they ever did on the other channel but some people just like to complain :)

I have to say that I personally like this feature as I always enjoy watching the races again, no matter how recent they may be. Fair play to Alguersuari too, if I was asked the same question in his position then I'd probably choose my first GP and my first points as well as it's races memorable to the driver in question. If you don't like it then don't watch it, simple as that.

Some pretty enjoyable races there, lets see if the weather can throw up another lottery like 2007 so we can see an HRT leading the race.

Well would you look at that, even with the closure of 606 a while back, we still have 'wind up merchants' lurking in the comment boxes. How sad are they, and yes Senna97, I am talking to you.

Anyway, Jaime's choices were really good, and the format is working fine. There are no restrictions at all, maybe the only caution to the drivers is that many true classic races have been taken, so they are warned that some of their choices won't be shown because they're too common amongst the other drivers.

@Murray Ö÷²¥´óÐã's contract for broadcasting rights of F1 ends in 2013, so Channel 5 won't take over. Bernie said that he would only go to Channel 5 if the Ö÷²¥´óÐã don't renew their contract at the end of the 2013 season. It is all, as you say, rumors, and they're mostly stirred up by newspapers that can't accept what's been said from the direct source

Terribly frustrating for those on Freeview - Don't reeeally fancy what feels like a whole year of "Horrible Quiztories" when we've already had it in May, wasn't it!?

Could you, at least, have some input in this, because, while I'll have a go at these "Quiztories", I don't fancy 2 months of some random actor telling jokes about being pulled through a hedge backwards.

It took the fans two years to dump Jonathan Legard - half a year on, I'm starting to feel a bit disappointed with the Ö÷²¥´óÐã - we haven't had anything else. I also don't fancy watching Lewis & Jenson doing photography. I thought the programme was about Formula One.

Senna27 - Surely you mean apportioning the blame? And as for your prior comment about 'like it or lump it' as a philosophy not fitting well with you in the supposed free world... Maybe that's because you missed the part where you're free to not come here, you're free to go and set up your own forum, you're free to apply to work at the bbc and attempt to become part of the team who put together this feature. Heck, you're even free to attempt to buy the rights to F1 if you really wanted to. I'd personally say that's pretty damn free and you're just extraordinarily blinkered.

And where does the proletariat come into this? No actually don't answer that, I suspect it'd only be pretty meaningless. One thing you can answer though - if you're going to insult everyone here who offers a contrary view to you by calling them kids and taking issue with another users assumed age, perhaps you can enlighten us as to precisely what your credentials are for your generally pointless and negative drivel so that we can pay it the heed it obviously deserves...

Murray commentating on the 2007 European Race... FAAANN-TASTIC!

Good to hear the 3 differant commentators, made a nice comparison.
Not really sure why we had to have the full highlights from a race the driver didn't even choose but as allways glad for what i do get :)

First of all, good choices. To add my name to the debate Senna27, if you dont like these choices, search through the bbc and im sure you can find previous blogs with the "classic" races you desire. Here is Some classic Italian races a breif search of the Ö÷²¥´óÐã found - /blogs/andrewbenson/2009/09/your_classic_italian_grand_pri.html

Just an idea Senna27 if you want to watch older GP of youe choice try clicking on the Archives at the bottom of this Blog or search F1 Archives

i personally liked japan 2006 and the re run of europe 2007 but im still disappointed at the lack of pre 2000 races even the sleep inducing and "boring" races from the 80s and 90s i reckon are worth a re-watch if at the very least to see the the "grand prix" highlights program and hear the legendary tones of "The Chain" oh and the classic pairing of murray and james

The best race of all is here at Silverstone, where us brits get behind Hamilton and Button from start - finish.

When I lived in New York, SpeedTV had an interesting series running to coincide with each race weekend.

The series was called "F1 Decade" and consisted of a race from 10 years before shown in full on the Friday of each race weekend.

A variant of this would be to show a race from each of 3 previous decades in the run up to the race weekend. This would allow for the considerably shorter seasons in the earlier decades.

there was no classic F1 on the red button on freeview earlier! :( disappointed

Personally, I think that it is really good seeing which races the drivers class as classics. I would class a classic on how great it is to watch but, imagine watching footage of yourself and thinking, "That race was a definitive moment in my career/life" despite how dull it may have been for people watching (like Jaime getting his first points). I also have not objection at all to them choosing races in which they did well because, I don't think anyone on here can honestly say (I think even Senna27 will agree........... possibly not!) that if they achieved something great they wouldn't want to remind the world of what they were/are capable of.

With regards to this forum, I don't have an enormous amount of F1 knowledge, so I find it very interesting hearing other fans constructive opinions on races. I am always dismayed when I see that people like Senna27 are dominating the forum.

@Senna27 - You have your opinions and you are very entitled to them but please understand that not everyone agrees with you. We don't have to so please stop trying to make us. It comes over as arrogance in that you think you have the greatest knowledge and have seen the most races so therefore you should be listened to. We are all very aware that you do not like the format and you don't like the races chosen. It's not that we don't hear you it's just that most of us simply don't care!

Rant over!

How can you expect Alguersuari to pick races like Imola 1981 when he's only 21 himself?!

I'm his age, and I've watched highlights of some truly fantastic races from that period, but you can only expect him to pick races he was either involved in or those he can remember seeing live!

I've not been on this forum for a few races as I've kind of 'tuned out' since the change of format produced races which I've only seen a few years ago and so aren't of as much interest to me. A couple of things I've noticed are the greatly reduced number if postings, suggesting that others have migrated from here, and the antagonistic nature of those who remain . This used to be a good forum to discuss classic races and to enhance my knowledge of all things formula one - now it appears to be a moan fest and quite an aggressive one at that. A shame.

55. At 22:48 23rd Jul 2011, Richard Upton wrote: "...I've kind of 'tuned out' since the change of format produced races which I've only seen a few years ago... I've noticed are the greatly reduced number if postings... and the antagonistic nature of those who remain . This used to be a good forum to discuss classic races... now it appears to be a moan fest and quite an aggressive one at that. A shame."

Sadly, that's quite true, Richard, and I visit a lot less frequently than before myself. Partly because of the infantile flaming, but also there is little of interest to me in the selections.

The new format has been at the root of the change of tone here, but like a lot of the Ö÷²¥´óÐã's less popular decisions (putting the DOG on its digital channels, the credits squeeze, the scheduling on the Freeview 301 channel etc.), there's a seems to be a culture of 'la-la-la I can't hear you'. Of course, if a newspaper complains, the Beeb can't roll over quick enough, and someone tends to lose their job.

The first year seemed to go well, but in Year Two it became obvious the format was limited. A number of suggestions to revamp it were made by contributors who valued the service's potential, but all were ignored and we got given this instead.

The most incredible thing is that it is quite obvious from the outset that most young F1 drivers are going to have a limited historical perspective, and no-one seemed to think this might end up with the same races being dredged up time and again.

The retention of the original name has compounded discontent, since it no longer describes the product. It's more like "xyz's Top Five" or akin to Autosport's "The Race of My Life" feature.

One good thing, though, is that we can't have this format again - with 19 races and 24 drivers, there won't be enough peddlers in 2012 left to survey across the whole season, unless we have an awful lot of driver changes.

I think I only come back myself when I remember to, just in order see whether the format has finally been abandoned, or if I should finally give up on it altogether.

I've been watching F1 since about 88, when I was 12. I have the back catalogue DVDs too, so despite my tender (ahem) years I'm fully, historically clued-up.
However I was actually pleased to watch the race from 07 because I don't remember much about it. It's always fabulous to see underdogs having their 15 minutes of fame (Winkelhock), and how the rain causes havoc.

If the selection was constantly "classic" 60s/70s/80s, I'd soon get bored of that. Sometimes the most "insignificant" races are a delight to watch.

57. At 11:36 24th Jul 2011, Capt_jo wrote: "I've been watching F1 since about 88, when I was 12. I have the back catalogue DVDs too, so despite my tender (ahem) years I'm fully, historically clued-up.... If the selection was constantly "classic" 60s/70s/80s, I'd soon get bored of that. Sometimes the most "insignificant" races are a delight to watch."

I've a fairly similar history in terms of modern F1, though my interest first began in the 60s. I then discovered everything that's bad for me, and took an interest in those lovely soft pink curvy things that giggle, so I got kind of distracted in the 70s and early 1980. ;-)

You make a good point to which I mostly agree - my reservation is mostly based on the fact that we don't see much at all from the 60s, and the 70s has been poorly represented. ESPN Classic has performed a much better job of that screening the F1 Collection and GBGPs of the 70s, and I think they run the Dutch GP of '68 from time to time (not sure of the year off the top of my head). The Ö÷²¥´óÐã's range tends to be skewed towards the late 1990s and later.

I'm all for having a nice range of races, which is kind of what we had before, where we'd see Italian grands prix (say) from different years, so I'd welcome some diversity. But we're not seeing that this year, where few races have pre-dated Schumacher. There have been some, but not very many.

No format is going to please everyone, which is why having one season from the past over the course of the year wouldn't really work, even though that's my (and has been others') favourite option. You kind of know what you're going to get, and there's not a lot to bicker about. Three full highlight races covering events say 30-20-10 years ago might be a good compromise. You get a mix of the good and the bad, but not the excessively recent, so for the sprogs they can get a handle on F1's history. Since the calendar moves about a bit, you won't necessarily have the same venues for all three races.

Not going to happen, though.

Europe '07: My main memory of this was having to watch it at my sister's place after I found myself stranded in Chester due to flooding elsewhere in the country.

Winkelhock leading was certainly a laugh and I've just reminded myself that that what would become known as Spygate was starting to get nuts.

Best remembered though for rain and crashes and a certain rookie still leading the championship when the dust settled.

GOOD-BYE F1, it was great while it lasted.

It was bad enough when it was on ITV with all the interruptions caused by the commercial breaks. Imagine what its going to be like on Rupert Murdoch's TV channel (SKY, yes it will happen) with the even longer commercial breaks. I will not be subscribing.

Come on, sponsors let us hear what you think about the loss of brand visibility.

What a sad day for F1 fans.