O'Sullivan must stop the rot (129)
- 16 Sep 07, 05:21 PM
Belfast - It wasn't meant to be like this.
The closing minutes of Saturday's World Cup win over Georgia was some kind of weird sporting for a stunned Irish sporting public.
Millions of Euro have been ploughed into this professional Irish rugby team yet for the second weekend in succession they have been embarrassed by the so-called minnows of world rugby.
Let's be honest here and the stats show it, Georgia deserved to win Saturday鈥檚 bizarre clash in Bordeaux.
A little more experience and more crucially, composure would have seen them cause probably the biggest shock in rugby union history.
As the rumbled towards the Irish line on successive occasions in the final minutes of the contest, the air of panic in Eddie O'Sullivan's side was palpable.
The Irish pack seemed incapable of halting the Georgians' steady march while the backs of the so-called Golden Generation appeared to look on, almost transfixed in their horror.
But they had also played their part in this nightmare.
The verve of that wonderful and the free-flowing rugby of St Patrick's Day in Rome seem distant memories.
This is a hesitant, nervous Irish team. The confidence has seeped out of the players and Eddie O'Sullivan has little choice now other than to make radical surgery for next weekend's must-win game against France.
That goes against O'Sullivan鈥檚 conservative coaching strategy but the script is simply not working and must be ripped up.
Granted O'Sullivan鈥檚 room for manoeuvre is limited to a certain degree - particularly in the pack.
He will soldier on with current props John Hayes and Marcus Horan even though like all their colleagues, they endured some excruciating moments during Saturday's debacle in Bordeaux.
But it's surely time for Neil Best's aggression to be accommodated in the starting line-up.
The Irish forwards look afraid of their own shadows in open play on Saturday night and O'Sullivan must start Best in place of Simon Easterby.
Donncha O'Callaghan had such a poor game on Saturday that veteran Malcolm O鈥橩elly must be in contention for a recall that would have seemed inconceivable a fortnight ago.
Granted, Paul O'Connell was little better than O'Callaghan but as mentioned earlier, O'Sullivan鈥檚 forward options are limited.
Prior to the , number eight Denis Leamy's position in the side would have been regarded as being almost as secure as Brian O'Driscoll's starting slot.
However, Leamy's awful display on Saturday means that Stephen Ferris should be in serious contention to start against France - although one is doubtful whether the cautious O'Sullivan will want to take a chance on the young Ulsterman.
And so the backs.
To my mind, Girvan Dempsey was Ireland's most effective back on Saturday night. He took his try well, made a couple of half-decent breaks and was reasonably secure under the high-ball so he will probably start at full-back again.
Sadly, Gordon D'Arcy now resembles the nervous creature that inhabited the Lions tour two years ago.
Again, his partnership with O'Driscoll seemed a permanent fixture but he is woefully out of form so O'Sullivan must either switch Shane Horgan from the wing or bring in Andrew Trimble.
There should be no debate about Geordan Murphy's recall. He has to come back into the team at wing to try and inject some life into the Irish backs.
In the half-backs, Peter Stringer must be in severe danger of losing the scrum-half berth to Isaac Boss after his nightmare on Saturday.
Stringer's shocking pass which led to Georgia's intercept try summed up his awful evening and while Boss has plenty of southern detractors, he should start against the French.
Glad that's all over? You're not the only one.
John Haughey is a journalist at 主播大秀 Sport in Belfast.
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I agree with much of the foregoing, except for Isaac Boss. He was a disaster when he came on for Stringer, gifting the ball to the Georgians on two occasions.
Eoin Reddan is the form scrum half in Europe, time for him to get his chance.
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There is no need to throw the baby out with the bath water but following would be enough to shake things up:
Murphy for Hickie
Reddan for Stringer (his performances for Wasp's show he is a better bet than Boss)
Best for Easterby
O'Kelly for O'Callaghan
Than would add some much neede beef to front the French and speed abd creativity to the Backs.
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Would agree with all the suggested changes, and add to that Alan Quinlan in for David Wallace
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I was one of the stunned Irish contingent in Bordeaux last night, which watched a lifeless and numb Irish side. The players looked devoid of any passion and confused. Other than that, they were simply outplayed. Oddly Ireland won their set-pieces and only missed one tackle! O'Callaghan made more tackles than anyone; so, if you bring in O'Kelly, it should be in place of the off-form O'Connell. Neil Best and Flannery should definitely start against France - our pack seems to lack any aggression or drive. Stringer is clearly out of sorts, as is O'Gara, but would replacing them change things? Trimble would bring absolutely nothing to the team. O'Sullivan needs to take the Murphy gamble. It is not beyond us but I won't be bringing much hope with me to Paris on Friday.
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Ireland are again struggling to cope with the pressure of meda attention.The big name players have not stepped up to the plate, and by the games so far the Big 3 NZ, SA and Austrailia are the teams to beat, I said to people before the world cup that Ireland would fail to get out of there group it seems I am going to be right. I wonder now if the IRFU regret giving EOS another 4 years, Ireland have improved under his quidence but he has taken them asfarb as he can. Michael Bradley should be given the chance to prove his worth at the big time. team for France O'kelly in th second row, Flannery at hooker, Leamy dropped Wallace at 8 Easterby 7 Best at 6. Boss in a 9 Murphy in for Hickie and I would keep the centre pairing the same but only just, we afre terible and a laughing stock of world rugby at the moment, only good thing is now we are underdogs for the next 2 games. I hope to be proved wrong
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I agree with Jason, as a very very proud Irish supporter, I was close to leaving the pub I was watching the match in at half time. There was no forward aggression, no life about the rucks, hence the need for Neil Best to start. Ireland have to stop waiting for Brian O'Driscoll to make the move, they cannot rely purely on him and Paul O'Connell. It seems that the squad have lost confidence and no longer have any pride when on the pitch. They need to go into the next match with a dogged, fighting spirit, otherwise, all is lost. As for my support of the boys against France, well, I'm going to be in the Stadt de France for that match, and I will not mind if they lose, as long as they play well. If they don't then, I don't believe they deserve to progress in the tournament.
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Agree with the article.Ire need to take a step back and not be as obsessed with the open running game. As much as i feel kicking away possession can be counter productive, O Gara is v.good at pinging the ball to the corners and playing the territory.This would give the forwards a lift and is a game that most of the pack are used to with their provincial teams. Keep the open running rugby to the opposistion half.
The team has now been written of by everyone so there is nothing to lose.Time to dig deep.
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EOS has always had a problem making changes...usually too little, too late as last night proved.
Isaac Boss didn't do much to impress. I can't for the life of me understand why Neil Best wasn't brought on to a game that would really of suited his style.
We all know what we'd like to see (Best on at 7, Murphy in backs, reddan scrum half)...but I doubt EOS is going to change the habits of a lifetime and do anything different.
And that for me is the difference...the big 3 southern hemisphere teams don't pick themselves...most know if they play badly, they'll be dropped, whereas our team (well up until last night anyway) don't seem to feel that.
It's grim, and I'm not looking forward to Friday.
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I've never seen an Irish team make so many unforced errors. Are Ireland feeling the pressure of expectation? I cannot comprehend how are pack are playing so poorly as a unit. The set pieces have been fine, but our restarts, and especially our rucking and mauling and support play has been so poor. I'd like them to play as 8 and try and dominate the opposing pack and just play a simple ruck & maul game. No forwards hanging around the backline. They should be in each other's pockets.
I would like to see big Mal in for DOC, who has played very poorly since the summer, and is probably a better impact player anyway. JF will probably come in for Best due to injury. We have to get Geordan on the pitch for a decent run (even 30 minutes would make a difference). We need more dog in the pack. I'd like to see Quinlan accomodated in the match 22 with N Best keeping his place, perhaps at Easterbunny's expense. Quinny is a big game player and with Best wont get pushed around.
The failure to get a bonus point last night means we really need to beat France on Friday. A loss there and a win against Argentina would probably not be enough. Ireland will be back to serious underdogs on Friday (unless France are really brutal today) and I guess that will help rise the team. Nothing like a bit of siege mentality.
It can't get any worse ...!
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I have to agree that Eddie needs to make changes before Fridays encounter with France. Whether or not he will make changes to the Team that failed to redeem themselves against Georgia after a limp and scrappy performance against Namibia is yet to be revealed. Why did O'Sullivan fail to make use of his bench to mix things up in the last 1/4 or the third half as the French call it. Fresh legs helped Georgia to nearly cause one of the biggest upsets in World Cup Rugby or indeed any Sport.
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First of all, DOC had more tackles by far than any other player on the pitch. He was strong in the line-out and showed good hands, MOK is bad at tackling (Eg, ROG try in heiniken cup semi), slower than DOC, less aggressive, and has hands which seem to be completely covered in butter. Plus there is a reason DOC made the lions test team. Or are yee suggesting POC should be dropped. I think flannery instead of best, best instead of esterby, trimble instead of hickie, Bring carney, quinlan, reddan to the bench. Dont forget, if ireland win the next game they are through despite the media claiming they have to win two, Argentina are as good as through,
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I agree with basically everyting above except for the comment to have Wallace at No 8. It actually is a very skilled position when the scrum is going backwards at a rate of knots!!
Anyway, can anybody explain why all the kick offs by Ireland were followed up at a pedestrian pace - roughly the Georgian players had 1 or 2 seconds with the ball before an Irish player attempted to tackle them!!!
I was in Bordeaux and saw some of the team at lunch in the town early last week and they seemed relaxed - but is Eddie pushing the traning too hard?
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I couldn't believe it took EOS nearly seventy minutes to bring Neil Best on, he simply has to start against the French. He is a big game player and can inspire those around him. The only other real change can be Murphy in for Hickie, the other changes like Boss, lack quality. However one of the joys of being an Ireland supporter is that they very often do the unexpected, beat the French in Paris, we've done it before.
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I can't work out what is wrong. Front 5 were fine, although the scrume creaked from time to time, but nothing odd in that.
Main weakness was in middle 5. Back row was poor, except Wallace sprung to life after the yellow card. Leamy had his worst game in green and Easterby was anonymous.
Stringer was very poor and Boss was not much better. ROG was back to his inconsistent worst. His kicking was poor but some of his distribution was great.
Back 5 were ok, but Horgan was not match fit, Hickie did some ok stuff. BOD thinks he has to win this on his own Darce was average. GD is too slow. Team for France:
Horan
Flannery (Best is out)
Bull
POC
DOC
Best
Wallace
Ferris (EOS will never do this and still pick Easterby)
Reddan
ROG
Hickie
BOD
GDA
Carney (Shaggy on bench)
Murphy
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Obviously O'sullivan needs to address his team selection however he cant really make too many changes without weakening the team. Flannery and Neil Best have to come in at 2 and 6 and Murphy on the wing for Hickie. Dropping Leamy would serve no purpose. His absence would be keenly felt. Remember Leamy was our best performer against Namibia. If he were to be replaced then O'Sullivan has to turn to Quinlan. Hes a big game performer and would offer a lot more then Ferris. Ferris is a big strong lad but lacks some of the most basic skills.
Stringer and O'Gara had terrible performances but whoever would replace them would not improve the team. Boss is full of energy which is commendable but hes just not as creative. Redden should be given a chance to impact off the bench. He had an outstanding season last year and i believe he could offer something different during the french game should it be needed.
D'Arcys been disappointing but again I dont think Trimble could improve things at 12. Its not his natural position.
Other then that only O'Kelly has a legitimate chance of a recall. I would prefer O'Callaghan myself but then again he did have a poor game.
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So Georgia never engineered any of the drama on display?
Give them some credit as everyone seemed keen to heap such on the Yanks for their display last weekend against England etc etc etc.
The point is, the so called minnows are making progress and this can only be a good thing if Rugby is to grow as a global game.
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were are all the ulster players in the team. the same ols irish faces boss in paddy wallace in trimble in.
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I said it once, and I'll say it again- Ireland are going out of the world cup in the pool stages! Remember, this Ireland side is largely similar to the one that got tonked 42-6 by England in 2003. I don't think Ireland have got better, I think the other home nations have got worse! Wins against weakend SH sides and poor home nations teams are down the oppostions mediocrity rather than Ireland's 'brilliance'.
BOD and Darcy best centre partnership? Try Mortlock and Giteau! Ireland have been overhyped and over rated for ages- now it is starting to show!
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Isaac Boss? He wasn't good enough to get anywhere the All Blacks, and now he's playing for Ireland? ... ridiculous mullet as well, a dumbass haircut doesn't make you a rugby player! I'm sure he used to be reserve halfback for Waikato ... surely you must have someone better??!!
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Horan
Best/Flannery
Hayes
POC
DOC
Best
Wallace
Ferris/Leamy
Readn/Boss
Wallace/ROG
Trimble/Murphy
BOD
GdA
Horgan
Dempsey
Boss
Best
Easterby
or perm any from any in the above comments.
Hey it's not going to happen is it - will be the same old guard I guess
- the above variations should have had a run out in the warm up - we know Plan A has been tested to extinction but what was Plan B? When we had Humphries and O'Gara at least there was an inherent tactical change.
Humphries was a much superior running half-back which with BOD and Murphy was a huge plus. Wallace is a better distributor than ROG so give him a go.
And the forwards are just too small - not a lot EOS could have done about this but he could have had a more robust back-row up his sleeve to give his halfbacks more protection.
Most generals plan for both advance and retreat........
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I would agree that Reddan should be given a start ahead of Boss and I agree that the whole team needs a shake up but I believe that wholesale changes will only make things worse. Stick to the team as it is but do something about the game plan. Sometimes you have to grind it out against teams like Georgia which is exactly what Argentina did. They won by 30 points but it was only 6-3 at half time. The coach has just been given another contract but I can't understand why ? Sort it out O'sullivan !
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Every1 has made fair comments but i think this should be the team
1.M Horan SUBS
2.J Flannery S Ferris
3.J Hayes P Stringer
4.P O'Connell D Hickie
5.D O'Callaghan G Murphy
6.N Best A Quinlan
7.D Wallace P Wallace
8.D Leamy M O'Kelly
9.I Boss
10.R O'Gara
11.A Trimble
12.G Darcy
13.B O'Driscoll
14.S Horgan
15.G Dempsey
Flannery does way more running than Best and is more consistent.
Best cuz of his brute force & willingness 2 run @ ppl
Boss is a lot stronger nd braver den stringer
trimble or hickie are both gud but hickie drifts out of games
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My team for France: Horan, Flannery, Hayes, O'Connell, O'Kelly, Best, Leamy, Quinlan, Reddan, O'Gara, Murphy, Darcy BOD, Carney, Dempsey. If we want to surprise France we have to make radical changes. If he sticks with last night's team we are done for.
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There must be something seriously amiss in the camp for us too lose form so quickly. If EOS is worth a 4 year contract before the World Cup he should sort it out now before it's too late
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I agree with the comments about Ireland's performance
I have watched most of the world cup and Ireland doesn't stand a chance against NZ,SA and Australia(they're playing brilliant rugby) unless they change the team. Ireland will get nowhere in the world cup with the present team
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Ireland seemed very flat against Georgia, that is plain to see. But i don't think wholesale changes would help matters very much. OK, its obvious changes are needed and will be made, but throwing in inexperienced squad players against a strong, talented French side is a recipe for disaster. It's there for all to see that the WHOLE squad seem to be struggling right now, taking out players like Stringer, who has partnered O'gara at half back for a record equalling 52 games, hardly a wise move is it? I think the Irish team have enough time to sit back, assess their opening games, and drive on come the French game. No need for major panic yet in my opinion
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You can't kick the way the Irish did and expect to win. They looked like they were afraid to run it the way they did in the 6 Nations. We gave Georgia, who were fascinating to watch, the momentum. The scrum needs more aggression and although Stringer was terrible, I didn't think Boss was much better but deserves to start against France. I don't agree with wholesale changes.
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I'm sorry, but anyone that says that trimble should be omitted from the team because of his play is clearly daft! Trimble was one of very few players that played well in the warm up games and played well against namibia also. i'd have him on over hickie any day. all depends on how bad his finger is at the end of the day...
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I'm just watching France casually swatting the mighty Namibia who made us look silly last Sunday.
Who should O'Sullivan pick for next Friday? A good taxi driver to get us to the airport asap!!
R.
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Surely there are more Ulster players you would like to put on the team too!
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Flannery will be starting anyway so theres one problem delt with, Easterby has not been playing nearly good enough for international rugby, Easterby has to be replaced by Neil Best, he has not been given a chance to wreck his aggression on the pitch. I'm a huge fan of Hickie however I think it's time for G Murphy to start.
EOS seems unable to use his bench, why? Use the talent thats there! Please!
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The matches against France and Argentina are irrelevant at this point, a highly paid professional national side that has had so much backing has completely lost the plot. Either this is the biggest wind up going, or there are serious problems within that team. The most obvious problem is that Ireland persist with a scrum half who cannot feed his back line quick enough, Stringer does ok for Munster but he is not of international standard and the fact that Reddan cannot get into this team is just incredible. Reddan, Murphy, Best and Flannery all have to come in to that team, but I doubt that it would make a difference now as the wheels look to have truly come off. And for that to happen against Namibia and Georgia, O'Sullivan has to go.
I'm struggling to think of many worse moments in Irish sporting history than at the 78th minute of that match. For that to come off so much expectation and hype makes it all the more dreary.
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i haven't seen any of the games because i'm in liberia but ireland have not played well for ages, except for the second half against france at croke park (match against england was against a very ordinary side). o'gara seems to miss touch several times a game (wallace should play). stringer kicks the ball aimlessly out of scrums (boss or reddan would be better). murphy must play. i can't figure out what eos has against him. the most important thing is eos has to make changes if it's not going our way. he needs to break the habit of bringing on the same subs at the same time in each match, no matter what the circumstances are.
surely the best generation of irish players in a long time cannot go down like this?
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I am watching the France game on the TV now. We are going to have a big hill to climb to beat France. Come on O'Sullivan shake the team up before its to late.
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ya there is enough of em,hope ye are watching what france are doing to our buddies namibia.
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I am a very disappointed supported who has paid a fortune for those Paris match tickets.Here's me thinking were in with a chance! It's necessary to make the changes but unfortunately most of the fellas you'd want to bring in are sitting at home - Heaslip, Gleeson etc. Some fight and dog has to be brought into that pack. DOC has been very very poor for quite a while and consistently gets outplayed by his opp number.Don't think MOK will bring anything additional so that's why I'd go for Quinlan at no 4. Best in at 6. Flannery at 2 (average player though). Reddan should start at 9. Boss is just not at the races. Such a poor passer of the ball. Murphy into his best position of 15. Other than that there is not alot we can change that would improve the team. Confidence shot, stale coach, disgruntled squad members, weight of a nation of their shoulders....not looking good. Ireland to step up on Friday! Typical
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Firstly,as an Ulster man I shall try and remain balanced!!! We're going back 20 years with the 'impossible to be dropped' attitude. How can anyone say that Trimble is not a natural center, only someone who didn't watch his best season (the one that got him noticed in the irish set-up) where he scored 1-2 tries per game playing in the center (he only switched to the wing to contend for an Irish slot). Paddy Wallace should get a chance, only because ROG's kicking has been woeful and that is all he's ever had, and defensively his channel is far too exposed (NZ were the first to realise it on the lions tour). I agree that Reddan should get his shot (too many mistakes for Strings and Isaac). And finally, it is criminal that Neil Best and Geordan Murphy have had to watch this joke from the stands. still not sure about Brian Carney, but then how are we ever going to know? (by the way when I was living in Oz, he was a superstar of the ozzie league game and league is a much bigger sport out there!)....So, my team:
1 Horan
2 Flannery
3 Hayes
4 O'Callaghan
5 O'Kelly
6 Best
7 Wallace
8 Easterby (8)
9 Reddan
10 Wallace
11 Dempsey
12 Trimble
13 O'Driscoll
14 Horgan
15 Murphy (at full back because
I want to see him get the ball for a change)
Subs
O'connell
Sheehan
S Best
Leamey
Darcy
O'Gara
Boss
(and with Darcy, O'Gara and Leamey on the bench, maybe then EOS will use substitutions!!)
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I really am horrified with how this world cup has started for us, this goes beyond form, i think there was something serious that must have happened behind the scenes because how this team is playing now makes no sense to me, i dont think o gara has properly recovered from that near death incident v scotland he and stringer look woeful, i agree its time for niel best redden and murphy have to be given a shout, i actually agreed with George Hook who couldnt understand y we tried to take the georgians on with the forwards instead of kicking in our haf and spreading it wide in theirs, y we tried to break down a padlocked front door when the back door was open......roll on france slainte!
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I agree that changes need to be made for the French game. The loyalty that Eddie O Sullivan has shown to the fifteen that started the first two pool games has given them a false sense of security. They should feel that every game will be their last unless they put in a performance of note. To suggest Boss should come in to the team is rubbish, he is a poor decision maker, trigger happy with the boot (he kicked the ball into a georgians hand when we were in an attacking position deep in the second half when we needed to retain possession) and not as good a distributor as Stringer. I'd take a chance with Reddan. I would bring in Murphy for the out of sorts Hickie. The most worrying performer for me in the backs has been ROG. His place kicking has been a joke and his kicking out of hand, particularly against the Georgians was shambolic.However,Wallace isn't a viable alternative.
In the forward I'd bring in Best for Easterby and Flanery for Best at hooker.
I only hope that we can perform better as underdogs against the French and Argentinians because as favourites we always flatter to deceive
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I think the team are confused by TOO MUCH coaching just like English football teams over the years, It will be interesting to see how the Munster forwards and Leinster backs perform for their provinces when released from their shackles!
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i think ireland need to play more ulster players and stop picking players thay eos wants on the team. you got rid of david humperys. rog canot find touch palce kicking bad and he is not a playmaker. it is all polticts with eos.
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Having just seen France hammer Namibia, it's very clear where Ireland's selection is going wrong. The French team had 12 changes from last week and every player brought in played out of his skin because he knew he was fighting for his place. Ireland's first XV seems cast in stone, with only injuries forcing a change. It's probably too late for wholesale changes, but I think either Best or Quinlan should come into the back row, Trimble should come in for D'Arcy and maybe Carney for Hickie. Geordan Murphy is not the answer, he has had plenty of chances to prove himself and has not come through. Something has to give because, on the basis of last night and tonight, France will tear us apart.
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Ireland beat France in Paris? Not a hope after tonight. How about that fantastic French win 87 鈥10 and against a SH side too! The crowd in Toulouse gave their team a 鈥渟tanding ovation鈥 as they left the field 鈥 WOW!
Ireland have won their last game at this world cup. They never stand a chance against France in Paris even when playing well, so forget about the French game. The game I鈥檓 waiting for is against Argentina, who are not going to let this bunch of dummies of the hook now. They kicked Ireland out at the pool stages 2 world cups ago and only lost by 1 point at the last world cup. Argentina will trash them this time and win the pool as well. Don鈥檛 worry EOS will still be around for 鈥4 more years鈥 鈥 just like Bush.
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I agree with Eamonn H - overcoached, they've been together ALL summer, played badly in the warm-up games (remember Scotland trouncing them). Also agree with the point about it being impossible to get off the Irish team. Those with memories back to the 70s will understand that one. There is also the favourites tag which has never sat well with Irish teams (although Kerry had no problem with it today). Disappointed particularly with ROG. I have got so used to seeing him getting the team going forward woith long ranging touch kicks. How many has he missed in the past two games? Well I have lost count. Also what's with this kick it up the centre of the field and no-one chasing? Why not just hand it straight to the opponents?
As for France tonight. Yes they did run riot a bit. Yes they would have won easily, BUT, Namibia's loss of Wessels was huge for them. Also they played with 14 men for 60 minutes. Generally you reckon a try to the 15-man side when someone has been sin-binned. 6x7=42 and now the French score is 45, not quite so impressive.
Continuing on the Ireland team, how often do you see reasonably good teams reduced to pedestrian level when playing not such good teams and raising their game to greater heights when playing very good teams? Anyway that is my hope.
But all in all I am very dispondent and am glad for my student son that he was so busy he didn't find time to pur that fiver on Ireland - definitely a fiver saved
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it was a disaster on saturday and it is because ireland aren't giving the the form players a chance, because everytime we had some sort of quick ball stringer didn't give it fast enough so i think reddan should come in for him because he has been on fire for wasps. Horgan hasn't got enough pace and won't be able to cope with a heymans or habana so i think it is time for trimble to get a decent run in the team and i think Neil Best should come in for simon easterby only if Chabal is playing because best will be able to counteract Chabals effect but if not Easterby stays in.
So my team for France would be:
Horan
Flannery
Hayes
O'Connell
O'Callaghan
Best or Easterby
Wallace
Leamy
Reddan
O'Gara
Hickie
D'Arcy
O'Driscoll
Trimble
Murphy or Dempsey
One more point Ireland need to go back to getting the basics right to do well at the moment it is just too complicated
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Depressing performances so far. Can't see the required improvement happening for French game. For the whole team to perform so poorly, our management has to be questioned. Reddan should definitely play in place of Stringer.
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cant help but notice a few insane comments, those of you talking about putting in paddy wallace at 10 should be shot, rog on his worst day is better than wallace. reddan should be in with stings on the bench.
to entertain the suggestion of changing the centres is pure insanity, shaggy doesn't pass and trimble hasn't proved himself to be a viable option, if you were going to take the risk try paddy wallace at 12.
fullback is a tricky choice with girv playing his best rugby and murphy not getting the opportunity to prove himself, hicky and horgan are first choice there are no other strong options not even murphy.
in the pack, well munster first choice is the best option, with maybe the exception at 6 which should be best, eddie made a big mistake taking 16 forwards instead of 17 with trever hogan very unfortunate to miss out,
the fact of the matter is we are now going into possible the biggest and most important game in irish rugby history in 6 days time, the time for tinkering is over. we like england going into wc 2003 have known the first choice irish team for the past 3 years, we do not have the luxurys of the bigger teams with strong competition accross the field we do however have a fantastic team who when firing right can take on the best, SO stop bitching bout EoS and the boys and start giving them your full support.
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if Sheahan is Munster's number one choice. Why is everyone selecting his understudy (Flannery) as the most likely replacement for Best?
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There won't be wholesale changes for the French game. Maybe Best for Easterby or Murphy for Hickie.
The team know what they have to do against the French. Keep it tight, silence the crowd, take all of their opportunities. Its going to be tough though, no margin for error. They can do it, we know there is a big performance in this team.
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The performance v Georgia was actually a repeat of the Namibian game.
The wisdom that the basic failure against Namibia was due to 'errors' and over ambition, while true in itself, was fundamentally wrong.
The team is over coached and that is why they are uncertain, nervous, very static.
Performance at a high level is only possible on 'instinct'.
EOS analyses the game to the nth degree and the danger with this is that players become stultified by 'thinking'.
They remain stuck with a 'clever' game plan and cannot get out of 1st gear.
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I had high hopes for Ireland as the team to make a mark on this RWC. Yet cannot fathom how Neil Best has been on the bench.........he went through Phil Waugh like a knife through butter. Leamy has good days and penalty giveaway days.
Stringer........had a bad day at the office but I'd still keep him at scrumhalf although it is now a tight call between him and Reddan.
No15 is a headache. Not keen on Dempsey and Murphy more attcking but defensively can be wobbly.Great shame D'Arcy's off the boil. Thought Trimble was injured....what about the guy fast tracked from League to bolster your scoring options.
Still think you can beat FRance and Argentina but you'll need to step up several gears and return to your best form.
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1.Horan - theres no viable replacement.
2.Best - Flannery has been terrible since his first match, Frankie Shehan replacement.
3.John Hayes - no viable replacemet
4.D. O'Callaghan - O'Kelly to old
5.O Connell (pack leader) - Experienced Lock but not old like O'Kelly.
6.Easterby - hes bond to be due a gd game
7.Wallace - pace and skill
8.Best - Aggresive Irelands very on Chabal.
9.Boss/Reddan - can't have stringer as hes smaller than i am and is slow at delivering ball, boss should have learnt from his experience in which he failed to use penalties given.
10.if boss plays shud be wallace as they play each week in ulster if not boss then O'Gara class player can pin back france.
11.Geordan Murphy - inject some flare into the team
12.Trimble - D'Arcy come on late second half his jinking runs cud rip apart the tired french legs.
13.BOD (captain) - best in the world on his day can't drop him.
14.Horgan - replaced by hickie has everything to prove after two dreadful matches.
15.Dempsey- has been irelands best player.
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If Ireland beat France then they are through. Effectively this is a do or die match. Ire can possibly scrape through if they lose but that involves relying on other matches and losing bonus points etc.
The match is even more important to the French lose and they go out of the tournament.
History tells us that Ireland will lose this match, we've never beaten France in the World Cup and crunch games of late home and away have all gone france's way.
If you compare the two teams unit by unit we either have parity or lose in each match up. FRow SRow BRow Hbacks
Centres Back3. This is in athletisim power, pace and adaptability.
Based on the two performances so far Ireland have made more knock ons, forward passes, turnovers and poor kicks than a junior 4th XV, on any given saturday.
Based on this you could change practically the whole line up usual arguments for and against.
BOD made half breaks and sould have passed after his good work 3times but tried to do it on his own, but this was probably as he was trying to make things happen.
OGara was very average but can you change him for P Wallace? Stringer's intercept pass, for a guy with so much international experience what was he doing? The whole team could see that pass being intercepted except him or maybe he could but decided not to throw a dummy as he would have to take a hit!
All I say now is that you will see a performance against France they still may not win but you will see a performance from a team that will be scared to death to lose, they have been breathing World Cup World Cup for months and to go out on whimper is not what this team is about and despite all that has gone they will be frightened of the flood gates opening to France and being the laughing stock of world rugby, though thank god England may still be a contender for that crown.
I remember playing a game against a team that put 70 points against us and hammered teams that had beaten us well. When we played them again all they had to do was win against us to win the league. We were so scared of losing by another landslide we actually won through sheer will to win and fear of losing. The game was of no significance to us but only pride. I pray that the lads can harness that same fear and claim a famous victory. Good luck, may the force be with you!
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Georgia should take tremendous credit for their performances so far. They have a terrific, big and abrasive pack of forwards that would trouble any of the 6 Nations teams.
They deserved to beat Ireland and could have taken the Argies also. They play with such an attitude, its great to watch.
The 6 Nations teams suffer from an acute dose of arrogance I'm afraid that makes them assume they will just beat these teams without much effort. Ireland have been pants so far, but are good enough to pull off a result against France. They just need to gain some confidence maybe.
From a welsh fan, suitably humbled by Australia's speed, skill and power.
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I think our only hope is that France get food poisoning, but even then they would probably win. Or maybe Laporte will only use those players he hasn't used yet. Chopping and changing your players is fine if the players you bring on, are as good as the ones that you drop. In Ireland's case they could not be any worse. O'Sullivan has said that the starting 15 was our best team, well those sitting on the bench must feel right eegits!
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Regarding the pack Ireland need to bring in Flannery at hooker (no issue there) and i would bring on Quinlan at blindside for his leadership abilities. Best on the bench. the only other alternative would be Quinlan at 5, Best at 6 and DOC on the bench.
In the backline I would replace Hickie with Murphy and put Carney on the bench. We need the unpredictability these players can bring.
Half backs. We must have faith in ROG and Stringer but Reddan goes on the bench.
It's all or nothing now. The team needs to be shaken up. Players perform better if they feel under pressure for their places.
Horgan over Trimble was a hard choice but Shaggy is too potent of a weapon to leave out at this level.
Horan
Flannery
Hayes
POC
DOC/Quinlan
Quinlan/Best
Wallace
Leamy
Stringer
ROG
Murphy
BOD
GdA
Horgan
Dempsey
Reddan
Best/DOC
Best
Wallace
Carney (Trimble)
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Handy Legend, you are 100 per cent correct, I've being telling my brother in Ireland the very same thing but he would'nt here of it. and who is convenceing people in Ireland that Ronan O'Gara is one of the best out half's in the world.
watching the hinaken cup league and seeing the curry cup early this year, does anyone not see the differance in class and comption of the teams
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It's time EOS loses his stubborn streak and faces up to the reality that the current fifteen won't cut it against France. This team is carrying a few players.
Hickie's best days are behind him- he's passed it. He's too slow mentally(remember the fourth minute against Italy-would have been easier to score) and he has lost the pace that made him so effective in years passed. Carney's in the squad, let's use him. Stringer is in a large part responsible for the Irish backline misfiring-he turns precious quick ball into slow ball. Alot of top teams would struggle with his service. EOS took three scrum halves to this RWC.It's time we see a change-Reddan in.
Best has got to start in the back row-Easterby just isn't at the races. I'd also like to see Quinlan come into the second row. He'll bring pace which O'Callaghan doesn't have. take a look at the second rows of NZ/SA/AUS-they get around the park like lose fowards. Finally Flannery has to start(which he will if Best is injured)He's more physical, equally mobile, has better hands in open play and should steady the lineout.
My dream team against france (and its just a dream because eddie doesn't change losing sides):
Horan
Flannery
Hayes
Quinlan
O'Connell
Best
Wallace
Leamy
Reddan
Horgan
O'Gara
D'Arcy
O'Driscoll
Carney
Dempsey
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'Isaac Boss... has plenty of Southern detractors'?
Come off it. I'm among the multitude who would see him given a start, and also, above everyone else, Neil Best. Are you suggesting a geographical or sectarian bias in their non-starting because they play for the province of Ulster? Can you back that up at all?
Seems like the usual paranoia, but you should not be feeding into such nonsense as a responsible journalist. The beauty of rugby is that all such nonsense should be entirely excluded.
It's harder to get out of this XV than into it... but the reasons for that I believe are not what you rather unhelpfully suggest.
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Having the disadvantage of being an Irish supporter in Australia I have not seen much of the Irish Games. After reviewing the above comments I am very afraid of the outcome . Lets be honest guys, the changes you have suggested will not make an ounce of difference . Ireland need to step up early on Friday and play till they drop. Bring it on !
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I agree with most of what is said and those changes required. Unfortunately the poor form of our big players seems to have filetered down to everyone else so I wonder if any changes would be a positive thing. I am very excited about the France game but not too optimistic. Some say you never know but maybe this time we can make an exception. Here is hoping I am wrong ....again
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Being a Los Pumas, I did saw the whole game as there is a interest on the outcome of the result.
I think for this group, the bonus could be crucial come at the end of the day. Now that France has just whitewashed Namibia, things could get even more interesting.
I have faith the Los Pumas will beat Namibia with the bonus point. But I have tremendous respect for the boys in green and it could still boils down to that game.
John
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Best the hooker is out through injury so Best the No 6 will probably get his turn (to keep the politically correct Ulster numbers up !).
As for Geordan Murphy, how quickly we forget his flailing-arms tackle as Ibanez brushed past him at Croke Park. At least Horgan and Hickie can tackle. We will need to stay close to France; get a bonus point for losing by less than 7 and try to make sure they don't score four tries against us.
I have a ticket for the Quarter final vs NZ in Cardiff. Before the tournament, I didn't mind if it was going to be France or Ireland... assuming the other would win the group! Looks like the Argies are going to top the group with the Europeans fighting it out for the other spot.
As for England, Wales and Scotland - well these are sad, barren days for Northern Hemisphere rugby. Back to the drawing board...AGAIN
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Comment on the "great French display" a little overblown.Namibia were without their fine outhalf for most of the game & played most of the rest of the game
with 14 men.If France couldn't run up the score in those circumstances then their world cup would be over!
This Irish team is capable of winning in Paris (more especially as now nothing is expected of them). As always Ireland seem to be able to play up(or down)to their opponents level,but at least they go into this game knowing a win puts them through.Its not so much a glass half full so far as the bottle has yet to be opened.Let us hope they find the opener
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I'm in New Zealand, so at 7am Sunday morning I made the special effort to see the boys in green. Thought I'd see some good rugby, but was dissapointed to say the least.
Come on guys! Bring your game up to your best standard, and you'll walk all over France and the Argies!
Play like yiz did against Georgia and Namibia, and I reckon that's the end of our 2007 campaign.
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Over-coached??? The excuse of all excuses. If there were such a condition then we would see an Irish side going over and over the same well rehearsed pattern. I didnt see even a glimmer of a pattern let alone structure.
Its a woefully underdone side.
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Re the Namibia match last night, I am alone in thinking Ref Alain Rolland had a bit of a stinker? Chabal made a lot of the tackle on the ground (future Gerard Depardieu?) but was back in action very quickly and scored 2 barnstorming tries in the second half. Red for Wessels was way too harsh, a yellow yes. Also 1, maybe 2, of the French tries had forward passes which Rolland missed. He also seemed overly concerned with speaking French to Les Blues, not quite fair on Namibia, this is International Rugby just speak English to both sides.
Wholesale changes obviously can't be made to the Irish side, but whoever is on the field on Friday is going to have to find and display a huge amount of passion, pride, desire and belief to avoid a tonking, and dare I say it even snatch the match. Not impossible with these players.
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The problem with the team is a mix of mental failure and belief in their own hype.
After France did us in the final minutes of Croke Park I expected a national outcry as to how our golden generation had so casually blown their Grand Slam chance so early in the campaign.
Then we beat the poorest English team to visit Ireland in living memory and we were running around the park as if we'd beaten the All Blacks.
When we beat experimental teams last Autumn from Australia and South Africa we started to talk about winnig the world cup.
Unofrtuantely no one really called the hype for what it was and the untrameled joy wihich accompanied a poor 6 Nations (yippee we won the Triple Crown again!) was not understood as being the hallmark of a team who could find joy in mediocrity.
We were never that good and mentally we are the sponge cakes of serious world rugby.
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they looked like england....
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I have never seen such a one dimensional performance. The lacked form and ideas. But trawling through the comments there seems to be a reluctance to replace people like OGARA. Well if the stars are not performing, someone who will perform is sitting on the bench waiting for a shot. It certainly couldn't be worse. Looking at the Score of France Namibia, I can only say glad I won't be watching on Friday night. The dream is over. The IRFU seem to have taken the 'book' out of the book of the FAI.
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Playing Neil Best and Carney provides the unpredictable....and to some extent the unknown which will be harder for France to prepare for and counter.
Murphy after 60 minutes would be a good option provided the game is not beyond reach.
Flannery is also a lot more mobile + can take the heat physically.....look at the hit he took from Jason White in the 6N.
Hope you do find your form against France.....don't want to find yourselves down to 14 for 60 minutes because Leamy overheats.
Reddan.......first Connaught man to play for Ireland? Hang on what happened to Johnny O'Connor?
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Tez
I don't see where the problem is with Alain Rolland speaking in french to the french players when it concerned them.
As long as he speaks english to the namibian or when it's for both team.
And, instead of trying to show the world how lucky the french were (of course, the ref was on our side, blah blah blah) you should be beside your team, supporting them as they probably needs all the support they can get right now.
As for last night game, we are happy they won, but, most of all, happy that the players showed Laporte where they play the best, like Heymans, so, hopefully, he will get it and don't do the same mistake for the irish game.
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The real problem is the squad has been set up in such a way that there aren't any real alternatives, particularly amongst the forwards. With the current bunch I'd go for:
Horan
Flannery
Hayes
O Kelly
O Connell
Best
Wallace
Leamy
Reddan
O Gara
Horgan
Darcy
O Driscol
Carney
Murphy
If it had been set up properly I would have gone with:
Young
Flannery
Hayes
Casey
O Connell
Leamy
Wallace
Heaslip
Reddan
O Gara
Carney
Darcy
O Driscoll
Horgan
Murphy
How has it all come to this???
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I agree entirely, changes are needed, but Eddie isn't likely to make many changes at all, which is why his 4 year extension prior to the tournament was very premature. The coach must come in for severe criticism for how Ireland are playing now and if he is doing his job then he needs to be strong enough to make the necessary changes.
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No.5 Jason says we should play Simon Easterby at 7!! Cos hes an openside flanker?!!? Thats laughable! Maybe we wouldnt have such a problem if EOS had have brought more than one openside to the world cup with him (let alone arguably one - Wallace is a 6 and always has been). He had 2 to choose from in gleeson and O'Connor and decided to bring Ferris instead who is a complete waste of a spot in the squad because hes never going to get played. Not because hes a bad player but just because Eddie refuses to make changes. Also, I really don't understand why he refuses to bring on Murphy...
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personally flannery is definitely the better hooker and he's much better than best when it comes to the line outs. eos is so stubborn and he has his favourites, hickie being one and i think he's played so badly this wc so far. geordan murphy should be playing. it's ridiculous, the whole being on form attitude is null and void now after seeing the so called "form" players so far.
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I can't believe the shower of brown stuff that turned up on Saturday. That whole 15 was lucky to be on the paddock after the performance against Namibia. They had a chance to redeem themselves against Georgia but failed spectacularly and now we could go into the Argentina game pretty much out of the competition if current form is anything to go by - suddenly that Argentina win against France isn't looking so good...
I thought the back row was set in stone but we need some fight in there and Neil Best and Alan Quinlan can offer that. Who to take out though is a tough one. Leamy might be out anyway so think Quinlan will get the nod. Wallace played better on Saturday but not amazingly so. He's still class but not on form. A toss up between him and Easterby to stay? Maybe keep Easterby for what he gives you in the lineout and his leadership skills (which are so far lacking). Wallace on the bench.
O'Callaghan was poor and that stupid penalty he gave away summed up his world cup. He's been nowhere near his best and maybe it's time for O'Kelly to offer up his experience in a key game vs the French.
Stringer has to go. His passing was bad from the off. Boss didn't fare much better so it's a straight choice between him and Reddan. Reddan has performed consistently well in Europe whereas Boss is yet to prove his worth. What's more, I think Boss is more of an impact player who can come on and change the shape of the game (although that failed on Saturday).
As for the rest of the backs, really not sure... O'Gara, O'Driscoll, Horgan and Dempsey definitely stay. D'Arcy is struggling big time, Hickie looks like he's already retired. Murphy has to start on Friday on the wing. Yes, some may point to his missed tackle in the six nations game earlier this year but better way to eradicate those memories with a stellar performance this Friday?
As for number 12, not sure? As mentioned, D'Arcy is struggling and has no confidence. The ideal choice would perhaps be Horgan at 12 but he never does as well as we'd hope playing centre in Internationals. That leaves Trimble I guess? Either one at 12/14...
Also, I'd like to see Carney get given a run out. He's not going to play another world cup for Ireland and he would be an unknown quantity. What's more is he's got the power and has played fairly well in his games to date? At least give him a run on the bench.
My XV for Friday
Dempsey, Horgan, O'Driscoll, Trimble, Murphy, O'Gara, Reddan.
Horan, Flannery, Hayes, O'Kelly, O'Callaghan, Easterby, Best, Quinlan
Reps: Sheahan, Best, O'Callaghan, Wallace, Boss, D'Arcy, Carney
D'Arcy still makes the squad as he might make a decent impact sub. If O'Gara is injured I'd stick Murphy at 10.
However, we all know the same XV will start apart from Flannery in for best (forced change) and maybe Quinlan in for Leamy (another forced change).
Seriously guys, if this is the case then I hope we lose because Eddie doesn't deserve to be coach. He can't see wood from trees and sticks with his favoured 15. This is detrimental on that 15 as they get into a comfort zone where they can play poorly and still make the team and detrimental on the rest of the squad as they must be thinking they can do a better job.
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Dear gods. Having seen the debacle against Georgia, and the French rout of Namibia, I fear for the worst. Oh, and just to rub salt into my wounds I'll be watching Friday's game with a French ex-girlfriend and her boyfriend.
However, all is not yet lost. And I'll keep believing that until the whistle blows - whether the starting whistle or finishing whistle I'll leave unsaid...
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I have heard it said a couple of times now that Ireland need to win their last two games. Is that right? I think beating France would be enough, as it would put us on 13 points with France at best six points behind, which would make us uncatchable with one game left. No?
Otherwise, losing by seven or less would mean we make up the bonus point we didn't get against Georgia, opening up all sorts of permutations for the Argentina game (which I won't go into now). As for the performances so far, either a) for whatever reason, this team is shot and the game is up OR b)they have been unable to handle the mantle of overwhelming favourites. Hopefully, Friday will see the re-emergence of the team we thought we had.
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I am going to cry. I will be in Paris on Friday having packed a sack full of hankies. Miserable performance on Sat. We all know that a fully fit and firing Ireland has it in them to beat the likes of France and Argentina. Almost beating France without O'Driscoll was testament to that. However, there has to be form. You can't play 5 poor matches and suddenly expect to pull a rabbit out of the bag. We are going home early - no amount of team line up changes are going to halt that. We don't have the depth that NZ/France has to make wholescale changes that are going to perform as well as your first team. BTW there is no point in continuing to rile against EOS. The players must look at themselves and ask are they working hard - have they got the hunger?
boo hoo
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Flannery for Best, that's going to happen anyway. MOK for DOC, bring DOC on with 30 minutes to go, impact sub (what a concept!). Same in the backrow, start Neil Best and Alan Quinlan, Wallace to come in with 30 to go (he's not 100% fit, it's obvious). Backs, have to start Reddan, Stringer is taking a step before passing, he never used to do that - Murphy for Hickie; not a lot else you can do. But if we're doing wish lists, we should have had Hogan instead of MOK for 2nd row, and Heaslip at no. 8 with Leamy going openside, and Best going blindside (or Gleeson or Johnny O'Connor). EOC left the real impact subs at home, time to go.
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What is the story with Geordan Murphy. In the last two games against weaker nations where we need his spark of creativity he was used for about 30 seconds. Is Eddie to stubborn to give him his chance. Sure he missed that tackle on Raphael Ibanez but everybody makes mistakes and deserves another chance. After all it may have been a much more different year in the six nations were it not for is cameo role against Wales in the opening tie. Girvan Dempsey has been solid and put his try away well against Georgia. But my God he is boring I lost count of the amount of times he called for a mark and just kicked the ball back to the Georgians. C'mon Eddie spare us the boredom give us Geordan it may mean the odd missed tackle but he might just give us that little spark that revives this world cup for us.
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Why does everybody base future results on previous results even though history proves that nonsense
Ireland lost to france but hammered england, england then went and beat France, Wales who then beat England. France were terrible against argentina...mainly because they were put under pressure
you cant say just because they beat namibia they they will hammer ireland..and namibia only had 14 players on the park
I'm telling you if Ireland had got a quick second try againt namibia they would probably have scored 50+ againt 15 men
There must be a reason why the irish palyers are not rushing after forwrd kicks...never seen that before
I think they are trying to play at a less intense level, whuch means their concentration levels are effected
ireland have hardly no injury to there big players after their first games
If i see ireland get hammered playing at a higher agressive level and still get badly beaten then i'll agree they are crap
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Reading the comments, I sense and understand the frustration but I have to disagree with the general tone. Ireland didn't actually play too badly. Alright, they didnt play great rugby either but the Georgians played a suberb simple game and didn't disintegrate into a tired mess at the end. Their forwards worked ferociously at the breakdown which is THE critical area in modern rugby and this was highlighted by the Lions tour. The problem I see with Ireland at the moment is the work rate at the breakdown which is slow and cumbersome. Players seem too lethargic in support. This may indicate poor or over training in the summer because you can see the commitment in the guys faces and in play on the pitch. Although rugbys' rules are sometimes suggested to be complex the end game is simple fight for the ball (sometimes illegally aka New Zealand ball) at the breakdown, quick ball at turnovers always put the other team on the back foot and should lead to points. Irelands backs need quick ball (which is why Stringer is miles ahead of Boss) but if the forwards are disintegrating and not protecting them at the breakdown they will get whacked. I think its going to be another weird game against France but if the forwards play quick aggresive rugby then we can beat them. There is nothing to lose now.
Come on IRELAND!!!!!!!!
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John, where is the logic in this article? Can you recall any occasion when radical change at this stage of a tournament has produced the right reults? Just about every successful international sports team is based on continuity of selection, working closely as a group in difficult times and refusing to panic (based on the theory that "class is permanent and form is temporary"). I live in New Zealand and followed the Lions closely in 2005 - after the first game wholesale changes were made and everyone said that the team played better, had more of a go etc, etc. The reality? the Lions lost the first test by 18 points and the second test by 30 (conceding 48 points)! So lets stick with Eddies's judgement because he's proved a pretty good judge to now. Maybe the odd change (neil Best) and some earlier substitutions, but these guys haven't become bad players overnight so lets stick by them.
As for the guy who talked about us falling for the hype .. this Ireland team has improved season on season for 6 years or more and won plenty of respect in NZ last year, and you can't do much more than put away SA and Australia the way they did. This team is capable of challenging any on their day .. lets hope Friday is when they finally start to show it. C'mon Ireland!
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ireland appear to think they have a god given right to beat the so called minnows..ie. how dare they tackle us. but come friday against the french they will lift their game on the really big occasion, and this time keep fully focused for the entire game,unlike the last meeting with france.
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The fault lies in the team preparation. They look like wee boys compared to other sides and have been overpowered by Scotland, Italy, Namibia and now Georgia. Other teams barge in to rucks and drive us out. We are always on the back foot. Maybe fear of failure might produce something against France but if we were to meet SA, NZ or Oz we'd be blown away. What was Eddie doing with them in Poland? Sack him now and start building for 2011. Don't think team changes will make much difference, Eddie needs to train them with a big stick.......
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Is there trouble in the camp. I hear Hayes was booking a flight home last night. Murphy and O Sullivan had a row during the week. Some of the subs left the bench before the end of the game on Saturday.
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Now then now then. There is a rumour doing the rounds that there is a split in the irish camp over Ulster players. Apparently the Southern players are not happy at the selection of Trimble and Rory Best. Both players have been poor to say the least and to leave Murphy and Flannery on the bench is mystifying. Any thoughts?
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Ted, over coached does'nt mean over rehearsed in any particular patterns.
It means over controlled in trying to play out any game plan.
It's not about 'form' at all, it's more about letting the players basic talent get expressed.
Easily said, but how to do?
That's the real art.
And there is quite a bit of talent so it will be a big shame if they go out without doing justice to themselves.
Changeing faces will probably makes things worse unless you get lucky.
Because any replacements are likely to make even more errors.
Unless it dawns on the camp what is wrong the chances are that it will only be when France are well ahead on the scoreboard next Fri that the 'game plan' will be abandoned and they will perform. And it might be too late.
There's a fair amount of fundamental weaknesses in Irish rugby, the people who play are mostly lacking the 'hardness' of the SH rugby culture.
It's unfair to condemn them if they do not perform like the ABs.
They are not really on that level.
They can produce the occasional marvellous performance but not consistently.
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'Tis time for the IRFU to tell EOS they were only joking about renewing his contract for 4 more years. They were weren't they??!!
Too much analysis and media pandering has dulled this "team"! Four (or more) of them need to retire immediately so that they can spend even more time with their egos.
It doesn't take expensive experts to figure out that whats needed (on top of the undoubted skills) is a dose of passion, pride, focus and innovative, flexible game plans.
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Think ireland may avoid a French backlash - Namibia suffered that last night. Also, Ireland have a tradition of playing badly against minnows - perhaps I'm being naive, but I really think Ireland will cause a surprise on Friday. In a way, pressure off -nothing to lose. If we don't win, that's just about it (though win and bonus point for 4 tries against Pumas may just be enough).
Idle speculating about team - EOS doesn't have it in his mindset to make changes. But for what it's worth, I would make 6 changes, and bring in Murphy, Trimble, Reddan, Flannery, Best and Ferris for Dempsey, Hickie, Stringer, Best, Easterby and Leamey respectively. I think that these 6 would play out their skin on Friday.
Come on Eddie, show a bit of adventure - and come on Ireland, we still have the chance to redeem ourselves. after all, think of the pressure the French are under - lose and their out. COME ON IRELAND!
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Forgot to mention - passion! That's what many of the other teams have got. They've got tears when they sing their anthem - some of our players don't even sing! Whether you like it or not, for God's sake sing it. I can understand the Ulster players not singing the National Anthem - but Ireland's Call was written for all
the players. It's a disgrace to see the likes of BOD and Hickie as if the words are in a different language.
Sing lads, show the passion - and do it on Friday for your country and we long suffering fans. COME ON IRELAND!
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The expensive preparation has been paid for,leaving us with a current massive overdraft.So we are were we are.It is time to move on and make the limited changes available.
The front row is forced to change with Bests injury so bring on Sheehan who will give it everything until he drops, then freshen up with Flanery.
The second row to be O'Connell and O'Kelly,the latter told he has a half to play only,to be then replaced by O'Callaghan.
The back row to Best,Leamy and Wallace with Quinlan at the ready should Leamy have another shocker.
Scrum-half,Reddan with Stringer available should this provide more problems than it solves.
Out-half O'Gara with a prayer that he finds form.Wallace as stand by in case of injury.
Centres,O'Driscoll and Darcy with Trimble should Darcy fail to find form.
Wings,Horgan and Carney.
Full-back, Murphy,with Dempsey as cover.
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PS as much as I am pessimistic about Friday I will still be in the Stade de France. I urge every Irishman/woman going to wear green and sing your heart out. Lets take ownership. I wish for an impromptu chorus of the soldiers song as ROG/Michalak prepares for kick off.
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Is there trouble in the camp. I hear Hayes was booking a flight home last night. Murphy and O Sullivan had a row during the week. Some of the subs left the bench before the end of the game on Saturday.
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The wheels have come off the IRFU bus and it is leaking oil all over the road.
Agree with comments above re over coaching. I'd love to see Eddie's playbook (I'd bet its incomprehensible, and looks more like formation flying than Rugby). Keep it simple lads - commit their players to the ruck and then spread it wide - there's no point spreading it wide if there's a traffic jam of people in the middle of the park.
I'm not looking forward to Friday I'll be watching this one from behind the sofa.
Need to bring in Neil Best, Flannery and Reddin. I played scrum half many years ago and would have been dropped from the schools team for the kind of passes Stringer "lobs" out to O'Gara - (that is when he isn't actually walking toward him with the ball in hand (can anyone explain why he does this?).
C'mon Lads, take off the skirts and give us a performance, even if we lose at least get stuck in!
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Well, team is released.
Reddan in for Stringer. Good call. Trimble in for Hickie. Good call. Flannery in for Best. Forced but probably would've made that call anyway.
Other changes? Murphy is completely left out of the squad! WHAT?!?! There is quite clearly some kind of personality clash going on here. To leave Geordan Murphy out of the match day 22 altogether is just completely ridiculous. I don't understand that one bit.
And also, no other changes in the back... Ibanez, Chabal and Harinordiquay are going to be licking their lips with delight before Friday's game. Quinlan and Best need to be both there to throw their strength around.
Lordy lord...
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WE ARE SHIT. GOD HELP US NEXT WEEK
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Totally agree with Liam at 95 re Soldiers Song.
And let them get rid of this whinge-making "Ireland's Call" and the 4p's flag. It doesn't do anything for the team and they ignore it. Use the tricolour AND the NI flag. Sing one verse of the national Anthem and one verse of an appropriate NI anthem or blend the whole lot together like other countries. If the mighty Paisley can sit down with Martin McGuinness, surely the rugby fraternity should show a little bit more maturity and willingness to compromise.
Among the many talented songwriters throughout 32 counties, there must be someone who can come up with a gutsy anthem that accommodates all viewpoints. Maybe in time it might replace the mediocre Fields of Athenry in the stands.
Just listen to the French anthem on Friday - best anthem in the world in my opinion. Never dropped it or changed it despite all the divisions and history they've been through and not embarrassed to show the flag.
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I think this finally proves that Eddie has lost the plot!
Murphy left off the bench?
No Best in the back row?
Lucky for Ulster,Leinster and Munster- we'll have our boys back earlier than expected?
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Agreed Chuck - Murphy's total omission is incomprehensible. Should the team suffer because of some spat between EOS & Murphy? Sad. However, I rate Trimble, he won't let us down, nor will Duffy if he comes on.
And how on earth can he leave out Neil Best? He would really have got amongst the French. That baffles me - should have left out Easterby altogether, with Ferris on bench as cover for Leamy in case he has another shocker.
At least EOS has been quite dynamic for him in picking Reddan - excellent choice, long overdue. Stringer is blatantly out of his depth, and Boss hasn't done any better. Fair dos Eddie, think you got that one right.
But at least we've got some changes, more than we expoected from EOS. So lets get behind the team, and hope they can show the passion that can beat the French. COME ON IRELAND!
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The pack remains unchanged??? this is ridiculous,how have Easterby and Leamy retained their positions? How can EOS leave Neil Best on the bench and Murphy isn't even in the 22? Trimble is not a winger, what was the point of bringing in Carnie to the squad then? Bring back Warren Gatland!
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What the hell is going on? Murphy left out of the match squad completely?! Is O'Sullivan mad? Replaced by Gavin Duffy?? This is the most ridiculous selection in the history of Irish rugby. He quite clearly has it in for Murphy but this is unbelievable.
Easterby, O'Sullivans favourite, on the otherhand gets the nod yet again. Is he the only person in the country who would pick him ahead of Neil Best on current form? If Easterby sat on his ar$e on the side of the pitch for 80 minutes O'Sullivan would still pick him.
Reddan at long last gets a run but what kind of match fitness will he have after being completely ignored by O'Sullivan for so long?? He is also completely lacking in international experience for the same reason.
Its time to sack O'Sullivan. He has quite obviously lost the plot. Whoever made the incredible decision to extend his contract before the world cup should also be sacked.
The Irish rugby team is a complete laughing stock right now and O'Sullivan is directly responsible.
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EOS announces the team for Friday.
What say you all of this:
Ireland: Dempsey; Horgan, O'Driscoll, capt, D'Arcy, Trimble; O'Gara, Reddan; Horan, Flannery, Hayes, O'Callaghan, O'Connell, Easterby, D Wallace, Leamy.
Replacements: Sheahan, S Best, O'Kelly, N Best, Boss, P Wallace, Duffy.
Stringer out, Reddan in with boss slipping off the radar.
Trimble in for Hickie on the left. only change up front is as expected Flannery for Best.
I think its a much needed overhaul in each position by EOS but drops short of bringing in N Best at 6 for his physical presence.
Still, im happy management had the gaul to stop the rot now....
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Can the idiots who commented about players booking flights home and speculating on rifts with players from Norn Iron, get a life.
You must have a good TV screen to know all that.
I tend to agree that we play better against good opposition, hopefully, and I think we will get it right on Friday... We were still trying to force the game on saturday, Stringer (intercept pass) and the others won't make those risky moves when playing the likes of France.
Here's praying anyway. Typical Ireland will play like animals and probably win against France. The exact opposite playing lesser teams. It we be tears all round either way on Fridy, either of joy or of failure.
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3 points.
1.Anyone who's been coached by Osullivan knows he doesnt like players doing things off the cuff, doesnt talk to anyone outside the first fifteen and if you dont do things by his playbook you're dropped.
2.You need to be a leader and a decision maker to be a captain not just a good player.
3.You cannot expect to win games because on paper you're better than the opposition.
So what we've seen in the first two matches is what you get when you give a team a script to play by and refuse them any latitude and ultimately no player has the balls or brains to change it during the game
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sorry i got that erse about face (105). boss on the bench and stringer dropped altogether ?? that is a suprise...agree with murphys absense being a strange decision too.
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I would agree that Neil Best should be included, but to suggest that Isaac Boss (!), Andrew Trimble (not a rugby footballer) and Stepehn Ferris should be included is lunacy. The may be from your beloved Ulster buddy boy they're just not up to it.
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I return to my earlier comment. France lose and they're out. Ireland will need just a couple of scores and a bit of momentum and the enormity of the danger will hit the French players and crowd. Having seen the state they were in in their previous pressure match against Argentina, there is a chance they will buckle. Can you see Michalak coping, for instance? Can Chabal be given a little reminder of the treatment he got at Thomond with Sale? France actually made a lot of mistakes against Namibia (whom I think would have given them more of a test if they the fly half hadn't gone off - great drop goal on the back of a lenghy rolling maul, if they had stayed at 14 an dif the ref had spotted all of those forward passes). All is not lost. Feel sorry for Stringer though and baffled about Murphy.
One other thing. Ireland's Call is OK. Just throw you head back and belt it out, for God's sake, and stop whining. Hayes and Flannery seemed to find it pretty inspiring at Croker. As for the flag, it makes sense and, as it happens,I like our provinvial crests and this is a nice way to showcase them all. It's an all Irish team not a Republic team. Honestly, with all the nationalist chest beating going on you could forget we're talking about an English public school game. If you are such great Republicans, you should really be watching nothing but GAA but there's a limit to everyone's political purity of course
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The expensive preparation has been paid for,leaving us with a current massive overdraft.So we are were we are.It is time to move on and make the limited changes available.
The front row is forced to change with Bests injury so bring on Sheehan who will give it everything until he drops, then freshen up with Flanery.
The second row to be O'Connell and O'Kelly,the latter told he has a half to play only,to be then replaced by O'Callaghan.
The back row to Best,Leamy and Wallace with Quinlan at the ready should Leamy have another shocker.
Scrum-half,Reddan with Stringer available should this provide more problems than it solves.
Out-half O'Gara with a prayer that he finds form.Wallace as stand by in case of injury.
Centres,O'Driscoll and Darcy with Trimble should Darcy fail to find form.
Wings,Horgan and Carney.
Full-back, Murphy,with Dempsey as cover.
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110 ed crowley said "If you are such great Republicans, you should really be watching nothing but GAA but there's a limit to everyone's political purity of course"
First of all if you are going to TRY and patronise others at least have the courtesy to read (and understand) what they've written.
Ireland's Call and the 4p's flag are not working in France. Fact ... many of the team are not singing Irelands Call - but maybe they don't like it much either. In the Croke Park situation it was linked to the Irish National Anthem. This is not about Republicanism but to progress to the maturity of having a 32 county, IRISH expression of identity in our symbols and anthem(s)
Seemingly Ed would prefer, perhaps, if we reverted to the UK national anthem.
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I say drop all all 6 county players from the Ireland team. The shouldnt be able to have their cake and eat it. They can create a North of IRELAND team and join the '7 Seven Nations', maybe create a second tier championship with Georgia and Romania etc.
We should have a Rep of Ireland team only, that way we can have a respectable,arousing, passion filled, non kareokee style, and better anthem and our flag back....
'Ireland calls' sounds like a middle aged reck of a man singing in Murphys pub wit cheap casino keyboard and backing track.
We are the only country who cant sing their anthem away..Pathetic.
Only country without a flag...Pathetic.
All for what? They even call us a 主播大秀 nation now...Pathetic
Aggggggghh.
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I believe that the irish team's bad form started the moment the video ref awarded france the try against scotland in this years six nations.
There is clips of the players watching the last couple of moments in there hotel after putting 51 points on the italians. Anyway when the try was awarded the players heads dropped after thinking they did enough to win the championship.
Two weeks later both leinster and munster had heineken cup q-finals and both underpreformed. Leinster were in
a prime position to win the magners league but they let it slip with all the big names not preforming.
This bad form continued through the summer and now into the world cup.
Hopefully Friday will break the habit.
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110 - It is not about being republican or not. We have a so called anthem which is embibes almost zero pride. We need something extra and there is no doubt that the Soldiers Song at Croke Park against England was belted out and co-incided with an almost perfect performance. I understand the issues with playing the soldiers song abroad and accept there must be a compromise but I am saying it wouldn't stop the Irish crowd singing it - just as the French sing their anthem in full verse. It may be that not all the fans want to sing it and thats fine and I understand it may mean nothing to some players but if it creates an atmosphere and pride for some then it is worth it. If any of you are going to paris on friday lets sing it out at kick off! We need a miracle.
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Someone said stop the rot maybe o sulliven is the rot.Anyone who lets Murphey out of a team like o sullivan does is effectively saying Leicester have no idea about rugby and we all know the answer to that.A match to be looked forward to may now turn into a paris sightseeing trip.What idiot gave o sullivan a contract before the world cup maybe thats whats wrong with irish rugby.
jim
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Jason, Yet again, politics raise their ugly head. I don't think the current state of Irish rugby is due to poor performances by Uleter players...hard as they have hardly stepped foot on the pitch.
Jason, again, It seems that it is the republicans who want their cake and eat it too...You want a 32 county Ireland, but don't want Ulster players in your squad...Jason, my man, where's the logic?
We have had a unified Rugby team for eons...and Ulster players have made valuable contributions to that team...Kyle, Gibson, McBride, Humphreys.
But it seems now that we are actually making progress on the political front (Paisley and McGuiness) that there are some neanderthals in the Ireland rugby camp who can't stand it.
In recent years Munster and Leinster have been in the ascendency and I have no problem with them being the majority of the Irish squad. However, I also believe that you need to play those players who prove their worth week in and week out.
EOS Had not been doing this. Nor has he worked with the provinces to develop the next generation...I fear dark days are ahead for Irish rugby if he remains at the helm...and no, I do not think Mark McCall would do a better job as some previous posters commented.
Sorry, for the political rant, but I get tired of Ulster players and fans being labelled bigots when others want us excluded for their own political aims.
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Ah the joy of being irish, we cannot even discuss our rugby team with out politics raising their ugly head.
Some of our countrymen here seem quite happy to snipe at their Ulster neighbours. One even accuses us of wanting our cake and eating it too...but surely that is the dilemma of the republican. They want a 32 county ireland, but then realise that it must also include all those Ulstermen and women.
From an historical perspective, Ulster players have made many positive contributions to Irish rugby...the names of Kyle, McBride, Gibson, Humphreys etc. And though I go out on a limb here, these players, and the current crop, play with pride when they pull on the green shirt.
In recent years Munster and Leinster have dominated Irish rugby and so, quite rightly, their players have made up the majority fo the Ireland squad. That being said, I also believe that players should be picked on their performance, noty on reputation and it seems EOS prefers reputation.
With an eye on the future I do fear for Irish rugby. EOS has done little to develop this squad, and from what i have seen has done even less to develop the next generation. I personally believe that the IRFU has made a mistake in extending his contract.
As for replacement, some have accused Ulster fans of being blinkered and implied that we want an all Ulster 15 with Mark McCall as coach. I do not fall into that camp...Mccall may someday have the necessary experience, but it is a long way off. No, find a coach who can develop and inspire the players.
Sorry for the political rant on a rugby blog, but it gets tiremsome when Ulster people are labelled bigots and hypocrites...especially when it comes from those with perhaps even more narrow world views.
On the anthem and falg issue...if and when Ulster does become one with the rest of Ireland, then a new flag and anthem might well be called for...why not start the process now.
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Ulster fan - you really have gone off on one. I have never ignored the Ulster contribution to the rugby team and I never sad the current problem is because of the ulster players, so stop being so reactionary.
And this is not a repulican rant on my behalf. There is far too much politics in Irish rubgy, so by separating into two teams, passion, identity, unity will be restored.
Stop fealing sorry for yourself, I never labelled you guys bigoted and the like. And dont tar everyone down here with the same brush either.
My point is, I am feed up with a mickey mouse kareokee song (ireland call) at the start of the games and a meaningless unoffical flag and a unique circumstance of an international team represanting two countries.
As far as I know, I think we are the only team in the world like this.
It's rubbish.......
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The Irish performance (or lack of it) has nothing to do with the anthems / flags or ice creams, it is about hapless mishandling, a lack of imagination and impact, no game plan and seemingly trying to play against their natural instincts. Ireland on a good day are brilliant, let's hope that pride / passion / ingenuity and teamwork make a welcome return against France, a bit of being the underdog never does Ireland any harm.
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Jason,
yes I did go off on one...and you, unfortunately were just one of the people whose posts set me off.
I agree with you that much of this situation is ridiculous. We are one island, but 2 countries. I beleive we are a better rugby nation when we represent the whole island. We will have to agree to differ on that one.
I agree about Ireland's Call...I would be happy with Fields of Athenry...but that ain't an anthem...but then again is waltzing Matilda and the Aussies seem to have no problem using it to fire up their squad.
I am sorry if you feel that I tarred all people south of the border with the same brush, that was not my intent. There is enough of that garbage out there, which was partly why I reacted the way I did.
Here's a question for you...do you think we Irish will ever be able to resolve our differences.
Finally, and for the record. I am an Ulster fan, but I am first and foremost an Irishman.
I want the Irish team to do us all proud.
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Re: comment #81
"Stringer is taking a step before passing, he never used to do that"
True, he would always pick the ball up, THEN look around at his options, THEN take a step towards his intended target (thereby flagging it to the opposition), and THEN - after all that - pass. So, what you're basically saying is that he's speeded up his service?
The nationalistic nonsense of Jason (comment #113) is utterly idiotic. Rugby's been the only thing that's united north and south for decades. Trying to bring politics into it now is, frankly, a reflection of yourself rather than of the worst that we can imagine within the Irish camp... and I'm saying that as someone who's Irish by birth and upbringing, not by ethnicity.
With recent Irish performances, I'm seeing forwards hanging out in the backline (similar to what NZ were guilty of for so many years, before Graham Henry took over) - Paul O'Connell stood and watched from the #10 channel while Shaggy was tackled and turned over, instead of going in and securing the ball - and the backs lying too flat to take the ball at pace, so the centres have no time or space to do anything before the defence rushes up.
Then again, I always played in the pack and have not been a Lions specialist backs coach who's just been awarded a 4-year extension to continue the policy of ignoring all but a "first" XV (only bringing on subs in the 77th minute) and playing in a way which negates Irish strengths (passion and fire), so what would I know?
(It's reminiscent of Laporte's insistence that France play in the alien-to-them structured way that England rumbled through RWC2003. Compare that to last night's game when they injected a bit of the old flair and rediscovered le philosphie ovale?)
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Jason,
you are right I did go off on one. I am sorry that I named you sepecifically, as your post was just one of many that I felt focussed more on politics and less on rugby. Which, I am in turn now guilty of.
I agree with you about Ireland's Call, and personally would be happier with the Field of Athenry...but we both know that ain't gonna fly. It's a pity as the Aussies have adopted waltzing matilda as a way of firing up their lads
One question, though...how can passion, unity etc be restored by seperating into 2 teams...that passsion has been there for nigh on a hundred years...the question is where has it gone? As Tom pointed out, I don't think the poxy song and flag issue are the problem...most of the guys on the team probably don't care about this issue...
Anyway, whether you like it or not, I am first and foremost an Irishman. Secondly, I am an Ulsterman who is proud of his province and its contributions to Irish rugby.
I will be yeeling my head off when we play France and hope the lads do the island proud.
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Jason,
you are right I did go off on one. I am sorry that I named you sepecifically, as your post was just one of many that I felt focussed more on politics and less on rugby. Which, I am in turn now guilty of.
I agree with you about Ireland's Call, and personally would be happier with the Field of Athenry...but we both know that ain't gonna fly. It's a pity as the Aussies have adopted waltzing matilda as a way of firing up their lads
One question, though...how can passion, unity etc be restored by seperating into 2 teams...that passsion has been there for nigh on a hundred years...the question is where has it gone? As Tom pointed out, I don't think the poxy song and flag issue are the problem...most of the guys on the team probably don't care about this issue...
Anyway, whether you like it or not, I am first and foremost an Irishman. Secondly, I am an Ulsterman who is proud of his province and its contributions to Irish rugby.
I will be yeeling my head off when we play France and hope the lads do the island proud.
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Re: comment #81
"Stringer is taking a step before passing, he never used to do that"
True, he would always pick the ball up, THEN look around at his options, THEN take a step towards his intended target (thereby flagging it to the opposition), and THEN - after all that - pass.
Let's leave politics out of Irish rugby, please... rugby politics as well as real-world.
With recent Irish performances, I'm seeing forwards hanging out in the backline (similar to what NZ were guilty of for so many years, before Graham Henry took over) - Paul O'Connell stood and watched from the #10 channel while Shaggy was tackled and turned over, instead of going in to secure the ball - and the backs lying too flat to take the ball at pace, so the centres have neither time and space to do anything before the defence rushes up, nor momentum to take them through/around the first-up tackles and reach the gainline.
The players look overcoached and unable to play what's in front of them. It's reminiscent of Laporte's insistence that France play in the alien-to-them structured way that England rumbled through RWC2003. Fine if it works, but don't you need a plan B if it doesn't? Compare that to last night's game when les Bleus injected a bit of the old flair and rediscovered le philosphie ovale... where is the Irish passion? Who's stood out in either game so far as having fire in their bellies?
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Well the team has been announced and, shock horror!!!, Eddie's just rearranged the deck chairs...
wholesale changes were needed, but eddie is not about to change his spots... so its time for him to go after this shambles of a world cup ends prematurely for us
I agree with most of, but not all of the above blog:
front row - no options for the props. flannery should have been on ages ago, even if just getting more game time from the bench
2nd row - o'kelly should replace o'callaghan
back row - best and quinlan, not ferris, need to replace easterby and leamy
half backs - we have no backup to o'gara. reddan's time is long overdue and boss does bring something different as an impact player... although i would have kept stringer on the bench for his experience.. he is too classy to punish his temporary loss of form so severely
- centres - again, no real alternatives here but both players are class enough to get back to form once the forwards start firing better
3/4s - murphy should have replaced hickie, with trimble on the bench. leave dempsey where he is
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there's no way o kelly should be in for o callaghan. o connell and o callaghan are the best pairing. what is it about the leinster influence- o kelly is way too slow to be of any use now.
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all ill say is if geordan murphy did walk out then i support him 100%. he has being used and abused for years now and is the scapegoat for eos brainless excuses as to why ireland havent gotten anywhere. ridiculous seeing as he was immense v scotland. the last i heard rugby was a team sport and one player taking the blame for a loss reeks of bullying behavious and serious denail to say the least. gerodan should refuse to play for ireland while o sullivan is still in charge. also v scotland in the 6n eos accusations of choking came very conveniently after yet another poor irish display.
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Ah, Jason. Ref your posting #113, have you forgotten you are posting on the British Broadcasting Corporation website? lol
You seem to have a wee bitter pill and forget the contribution of Ulster players to Irish rugby over the past century.
The reason for no Soldier Song at Irish rugby matches were the president isn't in attendance is because the IRFU had some foresight to drop it in favour of an all inclusive song that ALL fifteen members of the team could identify with.
And musicians out there would agree with the following: its not the song that has no passion, its the way you sing it. I'm not saying they need singing lessons by the way!
Good luck to the boys in green on Friday night. They need it...!
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