Scotland v Ireland player ratings
- 10 Mar 07, 06:57 PM
Ireland have claimed their third Triple Crown in four years with a dogged win over Scotland at Murrayfield.
Have a look to see if you agree with my player ratings.
SCOTLAND:
Southwell - 6: Looked for work and came into the line when he could. Showed good vision to launch a counter attack in the first half but later was held up near the try-line when he could have played in Paterson outside him. Came off injured at half-time.
S Lamont - 7: Scotland’s greatest attacking threat but showed his worth in defence as well. Try-saving tackle on Denis Hickie was superb and his attempt to keep an attack going late on typified his work-rate.
Di Rollo - 6: Quiet game for the Edinburgh centre. Did his bit in defence but with Scotland showing little ambition out wide, had few chances to shine with ball in hand.
Dewey - 5: Has had a fine start to his international career but received a harsh lesson from D’Arcy and O’Driscoll as the Irish pair both skinned him on the outside.
Paterson - 6: Showed how important his kicking is to the side with 18 vital points. A possible try was denied by the scampering Hickie but he cannot influence the game as he would like from the wing.
Parks - 6: Disappointed to be dropped for the Italy game but has probably done enough to retain his place. Steadied his side with some pressure-relieving kicks to touch but it was his mistake that allowed O’Gara to charge down his clearance for the only try of the game.
Cusiter - 7: Bounced back admirably after his disaster against Italy. Distribution was solid despite some slow ball and also added his weight to Scotland’s defensive effort.
Kerr - 7: One of the warriors up front. Some great tackling on two occasions as Ireland threatened the Scotland line and made way for Allan Jacobsen on 61 minutes.
Hall - 6: Solid if not spectacular with his line-out throwing and had little chance to make yards with ball in hand. Did more than his fair share in defence before coming off with 20 minutes to go.
E Murray - 7: Strong performance in the scrum and put his body on the line as Ireland camped on the Scottish line at the start of the second half.
Hines - 7: The man from Wagga Wagga was a constant pain and gave Ireland plenty to think about at the breakdown. His second-half sin-binning for failing to roll away stopped him getting a higher mark.
S Murray - 6: Celebrated his record 83rd cap for Scotland with a hard-working performance. Consistent display in the line-out.
Taylor - 7: Never stopped working for Scotland’s cause and was the game’s top tackler with 10. He also showed great skill to flick the ball up from the floor to start an attack in the second half.
Callam - 6: Effective enough from the open-side but Callam was quieter than his back-row colleagues. Put Stringer under pressure in the first half before being substituted on 54 minutes.
Brown - 7: Second only to Taylor in the tackle count and prevented Ireland getting a foothold. Was not able to show his rampaging qualities however.
Replacements
R Lamont - 6: Looked lively after his introduction at half-time. He made a couple of spinning runs but one break ended with a loose pass to O’Driscoll.
Other replacements did not get a chance to earn a mark.
IRELAND:
Dempsey - 6: Got to see a lot of the ball, especially in the first half, without ever really threatening. Spilled a difficult pass in the opening period.
Horgan - 5: Not the most memorable display from the Leinster flyer. A misdirected blind pass to Hickie on the wing outside him in the second half summed up Ireland’s lack of accuracy.
B O’Driscoll - 7: Was as frustrated as anyone by Ireland’s flat display, especially in the backs. Did his best to try and lift the team and showed glimpses of what he can do with the sublime break that almost led to Hickie’s try.
D’Arcy - 6: Led the ball-carrying stats with 12 but after a positive start, did not have the same kind of influence as he did at Croke Park against England.
Hickie - 8: Ireland’s best player and deservedly claimed the man-of-the-match award. Bundled into the corner flag by Lamont before being able to touch down and showed his defensive qualities with strong tackles on Paterson and Southwell.
O’Gara - 7: A difficult day for the Munsterman as he did not get an enormous amount of quick ball to work with. Was sharp enough to block Parks’ kick for his first-half try and apart from one miss, his place kicking was consistent.
Stringer - 6: Dogged and committed but with his pack battling to get parity, could not deliver the service he wanted.
S Best - 5: Given a tough going over by the Scotland front row and struggled to dominate his opposite number.
R Best - 6: Kept Ireland’s well-drilled line-out ticking along with some accurate throwing. Did not have many chances get ball in hand however, and was substituted on the hour mark.
Hayes - 6: A tough day at the office as he received a thorough examination at the hands of the Scotland scrum. Penalised for going to ground in the first half but was an annoying presence at the breakdown.
O’Callaghan - 7: The Munster second row was solid and a tower of strength in the line-out. One of the game’s top tacklers with nine.
O’Connell - 7: A mixed day for the 27-year-old who starred in the win over England. He came up with some vital steals but he also failed to collect a re-start and had a midfield mix-up with D’Arcy which gave possession back to Scotland.
S Easterby - 7: Constantly tried to break the gain line and earned his money with some fine work at the breakdown before coming off with 22 minutes to go. His support was vital in the build-up to O’Gara’s try.
D Wallace - 6: Never stopped working although a quieter game than usual. Made some good carries but was pinged for slowing the ball in the second half.
Leamy - 7: Second only to D’Arcy in the amount of carries and gave his all to the cause but did not get the yardage he would have liked.
Replacements did not get a chance to earn a mark.
Wales 27-18 England
Comments Post your comment
Fair assessments except that Horan did not play. Try Simon Best at loose head
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Horan wasn't playing - so a five is a pretty fine rating. Maybe if you had been watching Simon Best would have rated better than a 5 for all his work around the park as well as steady scrumming. PC
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Great comments Mark Orlovac how did Marcus get 6 points from you without even playing the game?
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I think that the Horan rating was unfair considering the fact that he wasn't playing
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I'm very surprised Horan scored so well as he was not playing. Simon Best was the other prop.
BOD was unhappy with the early start and maybe this was why it was such a flat dull game. Ireland did just enough to win and deserved another Triple Crown.
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scottland were better team and desirved to win. he irish were lucky once again. They cant expect to beat the ABs with a performance like that
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some of those ratings are a bit tough on ireland. note your total ratings for the two teams is the same.
A really old fashioned 1980s match here with defences well on top.
With horan absent probably well please to get 5 marks for doing nought( like his replacement)
couldnt help thinking with ireland running the ball al the time that like in AF, youve got to mix in some kicks to keep the defense honest
Should be great match in rome next week. Think the ref really bootled it there today !!
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Horan did well to get a 5 out of 10 considering how little time he spent on the pitch ;-)
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Notice that the so called second best team in the world rolled into town{Edinburgh}and scraped a win,if I was a Kiwi I would be terrified.
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Was at the game and Scotland did really well and I think most of us Scots are happy enough. There were some Irish saying that it would be a white wash after the Italy game but thats just an insult to Italy as they will soon be the team to watch...maybe :-)
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If parks hadn't gifted that silly charge down...scotland would have won! simple
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Oops, my mistake. Good spot about the Horan inclusion.
I had set the template up for this before he pulled out on Friday and I totally forgot to change it ahead of the game.
My sincere apologies.
I can assure you that I was writing about Best however and I just thought he did not impose himself.
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as an irishman i agree with the irish ratings.ireland where very ordinary today and could have easily lost the game.however i think it shows how good this team is when they went 5pts down with 10mins left they didnt panic.a sign of a good team is to win when playing bad and apart from the england game we are doing that.
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O'Driscoll a 7 your having a laugh he was awful ,he is consistently overated.He should have been binned in the first half for 2 petulent slaps at Scottish players.But then he is some sort of God isnt he??
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watched the game on the TV, couldn't take my eyes off it, possibly the best game in the 2007 six nations so far? Mabye Ireland were a bit over confident after our pounding off of Italy. Ireland were always going to win but Scotland showed some fantastic play. Paterson was fairly quiet from what i could see. If we keep this up we may be able to make a match when New Zealand come to visit
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>but thats just an insult to Italy as they will soon be the team to watch.... In 5 to 7 years team Italy will be challenging to win the 6Ns outright. A lot can change within that time. Italy have a huge population who have fantastic soccer skills. With the incredible growth in interest in rugby in Italy it will just be a matter of time before they get a backline who will them do justice.
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Christ we were woeful - I'd swear the boys were out on the batter last night! I suppose we should be happy that we won, but....
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Why discount Paterson's kicking performance? Bit like discounting a hooker's hooking. He needed some more passes from selfish outside backs for him to get a higher mark for general play, but his kicking was outstanding and kept us in the game, so he deserves more points.
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If the total ratings are equal... well Ireland did only win by one point and were seriously aided by another Scotland charged kick, so maybe it's fair. No one player really stood out for me, Hickie did fairly well but it's slightly clutching at straws.
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Can't agree with Hadden's comment post match re 'Ireland getting away with it'. Nobody that watched the match with me at any point felt worried that Ireland was going to lose! Like any good team playing badly they can always grind out a win. If the Ireland hadn't made so many errors (most of which were of their own doing) at the wrong time and got in to their stride as they did against England you always felt that they could have done greater damage to what is afterall a very average outfit.
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Just like to remind Mack that when Ireland played the best team in 'The House Pain' last they too scraped a win again Ireland!!!!!!
Mack the proof is in the results and results don't lie particularly when they are consistent. Even the great teams have off days....but they still eek out a win!
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Frank how can you say Ireland were lucky again. They've beaten they three home nations. Dear I say, you probably thought Frnace were lucky against Ireland particularly in light of the way that they eventually won.
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We were poor but just deserved to shade it. Scotland never threatened the the Irish line. Agree just about with the ratings though.
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If Ireland are the best the home nations have to offer, God help us in the world cup! They didn't deserve a triple crown on those performances.
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dreadfull stuff, but you get games like that and they stuck in there - well done the Irish. Lets home the English can do a number on the French tomorrow and open the championship up.
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I have just been introduced to Rugby,by my toyboy,
And I must say once i uderstand the rules, I will love it as much as football.
pity Scotland got beat ,by one point today,they may as well have been beaten by a hundred.
great game.
regards
Bunty
(79)
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Just shows it is quite an average team and wins in November were due to second rate opposition. last time out was the usual one good game of the season
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cant comment on the player ratings as the game was'nt televised here in Australia but I can say how far Ireland have come when they are disappointed in 'how' they have won a triple crown. In the old days just winning was enough. But the sobering reality is how far further they have to come to challenge a team like New Zealand. There remains a 20 point chasm......but hope springs eternal.
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May I add that Neil Best did play as a replacement for Simon Easterby. I agree with the comment that Ireland were poor today but to play poorly and win is a sign of a strong team. All credit to Scotland for a brave performance. On Brian O'Driscoll - his covering and defence was excellent - a true captain who steps in and fights for his players.
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O'Driscoll over-rated as usual, more fluff than substance! Thank you Ronan - as always. My man Stringer! we can depend on him every time.
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pete are you mad or drunk ,O'Driscoll is awesome
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Exciting because the outcome was in the balance till the final whistle but poor quality overall. From a Scottish perspective the pack and especially the front five gave Ireland a tough day but the lack of confidence and ambition with ball in hand is worrying. Endless recycling of ball already is counter-roductive and low on entertainment value. The Lamont brothers show the required spirit of adventure but the back row is one dimensional and needs a quicker and more creative player.
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Martin, Martin, Ireland won the three games and have won the TC three times over the past four years. Whether you think a Ireland deserved to win or not is really irrelevant. The fact is Ireland still won all of those games and HAMMERed South Africa and Australia while only narrowly losing to the All Blacks very late in the games in NZ. Ireland are not the finished article I agree but they are certainly moving in the right direction for the most part. LETS FACE IT YOU CANNOT WIN A TC 3 OUT OF 4 AND NOT DESERVE IT. Dare I say it but I think there's a touch of anti-Irish in the air. TC, Magners & Heineken Cup 2006 and there's still a chance for us to repeat it in 2007.
As regards BO'D, for someone to say he's overrated.....well they should really be waiting something else....
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fair judgement of players on the park.do scotlands players know they are professional rugby players and supposed to entertain their fans.no wonder scottish rugby is in turmoil.cynical display by a team afraid of playing rugby and not to mention devoid of talent and cutting edge.ireland and france are vying for no 2 spot against blacks.nobody else are putting up their hands to challenge them.deserved victory for italy today although referreing was a low point.
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Ireland won, what more is there to be said. A win is a win.
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Sorry, but the Lamonts both deserve better ratings than that. Sean's defence and line breaks today would win him a place in the Ireland team and his brother was on fire when he came on. The Scots can only hope there are more of them to come. The boys have passion, pace and a desire to win that the Scots team lacks.
Apart from that Paterson was solid and (perhaps) o' Gara played better than your stats suggest, but the Irish front five lacked the fire they showed against England an were convincingly outplayed.
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The player ratings are okay. Ireland were the better side over all, we just can't adjust to the favourites tag, we'll probably make a meal of the Italian game too. I never thought I'd say this but...good luck to England tomorrow.
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your having a laugh pete o driscoll is brilliant in attack and defence if anything he is underrated
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Not agree completely with the ratings. I think Hickey, while playing well did not look fit. A fit hickey would have finished off the try.
O'Gara scored all Irelamd's points yet is considered to have a mised game? Is this just the high standard he has set. Any other out half in the 6 nations would have got MOTM.
Impressed by BOD backing up his players especially after the sly punch from Patterson. And took it well with the ref.
I think we will win next week. We had a poor game, but should get ball and will break down the Italian defence.
Credit to Scotland. outstanding defence and very proud. I think Italian game was a freak for the scots.
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I would say most ratings fair- but I would like to remind some of you that before this match Scotland where not deemed even to have a chance, and yes ireland didn't play to their best but you must agree that considering the fact they had the ball for the majority, especially in the second half that they would have scored a lot more without such solid scottish defence. Of course I wish scotland had taken the ball wide more often but i really must still say that sean lamont was amazing throughout and cusiter looks to have gotten oven the italy game- some of his tackles were brilliant! Fair play to irish though they managed a win even when not at their best.
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i agree with most of the other peoples comments but i disagree how you gave the Dorce 6 for his performance as you said he lead the ball-carring stats and did not put a foot wrong in the whole game and even up against big rob dewey it still took dewey and another person to take him down(always makes ground)(on of the most under-rated players in the world)
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Horgan should have been substituted -Ireland's decision making wasn't great - and their penalty count in the first half kept Scotland in the game which should have been won by then. Scotland managed to slow Ireland's ball to a standstill and the Irish backs looked very predictable with little real movement. Not a great Irish performance - winning because they are in the habit of winning.
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On the day, 2 sides playing pretty mediocre rugby, although Scotland played with a lot of heart - wouldn't rate anyone over 6.
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Well done Ireland, not the best day at the office but job done. Many of you seem to be bitter that we are winning - 'lucky', 'getting away with it', 'don't deserve a triple crown based on those performances', etc...
Dry your eyes and better luck next year. Wales....hilarious, England...pathetic, Scotland...nothing to offer.
Good night from Oz
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I'm sorry to say this, but having been at the Scotland vs Ireland game today and the overall performances of the Six Nations teams, the only team the has a hope in hell of breaking the All Black line at WC'07 has to be the French. Ireland have the defensive capabilities, but still lack an edge to their attacking play. As for Scotland, the backline is woefully one dimensional and run the ball from a standstill!
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I thought the Scots threw it away. They were 5 points ahead with just over 10 minutes to go and they gave away 2 needless penalties. If I were Hadden I would be tearing my hair out. Ireland were quite frankly rubbish and although I think the Irish have a pretty good team - they were excllent against England - they are not as good as France (who have had about a third of their first team missing in this tournament) and they are nowhere near as good as the All Blacks. Can you imagine the All Blacks struggling to overcome that Scottish team?
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Yes Scotland could have won (quie easily) and those Lamont lads are scary and deserved a better rating. Think O'Gara deserves more credit as he was targeted throughout the game. Who tried to choke him?
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Ireland won today despite everything going Scotlands way in terms of keeping Ireland from turning possession into points. Scotland have done the exact same thing to England, Wales and the 'mighty' French over the past year in Murrayfield and none of those sides could get a win. Well done Ireland, a hard-fought and at times frustrating win but well deserved. Scotland proved today that when their defence stands up they are trouble to anyone. Hopefully wins from behind like that will stand to Ireland against stronger opposition.
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Scotland seem to have a knack of bringing teams to their level, which is OK for them but makes for rubbish rugby.
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This Irish team is way too inconsistent at the moment. Played great rugby in November and against England. They were flat against Wales, Scotland and France. EOS will have to address this issue before the WC or else we could go out in the first round. They are not good enough to beat the better teams playing like this.
However, I believe they are well capable of beating anyone (except NZ) on their day. However, two flat performances against Argentina and France at the WC and they're done. BOD is superb and anyone who says otherwise is talking nonsense. It is not just what he does with the ball, it is how he tackles and the space he creates for the other backs that is equally as important. Stuff unnoticed by the rugby clueless.
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Ireland over confident & let Scotland get under their skins. But Scotland should have had more than one sin binning. Wouldn't have considered Patterson a dirty player but his elbow/shoulder was a cheap shot. EOS was apparently claiming that a Scottish player tried to choke O'Gara at the very end & that it caused him to go blue in the face. Well done to Ireland for overcoming the Scots without playing well.
BTW, no.14 Pete, what planet are you on? BOD was superb in a game where Ireland were out of sorts.
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O'Driscoll was awful in a game Ireland barely deserved to win. Yes Scotland brought them down to their level but the Ireland that put 43 points on England two weeks ago should've had Scotland buried inside 20 minutes.
The fact they never shows two things:
1) They under-estimated and disrespected the threat that Scotland posed
2) They are not the "World Class" side that they are made out to be.
Yes a Triple Crown is a grand achievement. But the fact that Ireland are going home with only that and not a Grand Slam says a lot.
ps - Eddie O'Sullivan has a cheek saying O'Gara was almost strangled. No Scotsman would ever deliberately try to seriously injure a fellow professional. If he wants to point fingers at people for attempting such, he should look no further than "Captain Marvel" O'Driscoll who shoulda been sin-binned for his swing at Paterson.
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William Walker, after going to almost obsessional lengths to refute every last criticism of Ireland - no matter how minor - concludes that there's 'a touch of anti-Irish in the air'. This is the sort of nonsense that makes me ashamed to be Irish. When are we going to grow up and accept that people who make legitimate criticisms of a sporting team are not anti-Irish. Ireland were poor against Scotland (all the local commentators here in Ireland were agreed on that point), and pointing this out has nothing to do with prejudice. It's a sure sign of an inferiority complex when someone reacts to criticism in such an over-sensitive and hysterical manner. And it is, unfortunately, a typically Irish thing, one that we never seem to be able to grow out of. If someone criticises the New Zealand rugby team, do Kiwis think that person is prejudiced against them and their country? Of course not. It doesn't even occur to them, because they're self-confident and adult enough to be able to take it. Any normal country would react in the same way, but not us, it seems.
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come on, we've all seen upsets against the scots. england and france last year, wales this year (and argauably ireland too). but we didn't succumb. don't think the game in the RWC against argentina won't be like that. but the team with strength of charater will be prevail. ditto against the french on our revenge attempt.
but i admit our shortcomings. and it's the attitude rather than the talent level that bothers me. it's almost like we need a world class challenge to feel justified in playing like a world class team. why bother otherwise? do you think NZ or signifianct others wouldn't have seen the game as an opprotunity for a confidence boost and a substitute for the trainig ground? that sort of mentality is a primitive prerequisite at this stage...
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Pete!!!!
Brian O'Driscoll is rated so highly, not simply by his supporters, but by top professional players and analysts alike. What qualifies you to consider him over rated. You have either not followed his career, or have simply no idea of what constitutes an outstanding Rugby performance. BOD has a talent in all areas of the game that all professionals aspire to achieve. Whilst, like every other player, he has the odd bad day, in general he plays to a consistently high level, which is clear to see from the outstanding achievements his Irish team have maintained. Suggest you review his career and achievements alike before posting a critique that is based on a complete lack of knowledge of the game.
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ratings are just about right.anyone who thought scotland were going to roll over were having a laugh.they are not as bad as everyone thinks,just had some unlucky breaks.as for ireland another good result whatever the performance.as for petes comment what rugby has he been watching with the past few years.even new zealanders would agree BOD is best centre in world rugby
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(a Scot in Wales watching two poor games yesterday).
Scotland:
Defence - 8/10
Pack - 7/10
But we are so limited behind the pack that on this form we will need 80% not 60% possession to win against a top 10 side.
Having said that apart from the charge down Parks did ok, and the wings were on good form.
But the weaknesses are glaring. Cusiter has been worked out by other teams as he cracks under pressure behind the ruck/tackle breakdown, whilst his passing is slow high and predictable. Southwell and Dewey run into tackles like 12 year olds and Di Rollo seems afraid to test his opponents or sully his gloves with a hand off. None of these 3 deserve more than 4 out of 10. Henderson is never going to be international class. On the upside Rory Lamont seems a breath of fresh air and we need more aggressive runners like him who are going to at least TRY and make an attacking move work!
I am quite worried about the stuffing the French backs will give us if the play to form - only chance we have is if hey play Lashvili who is the only slower passer in the game than Cusiter.
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Poor display from Ireland.
Brian O'Driscoll is obviously too big a star to be sin binned for throwing a punch.Wonder if it was Danny Grewcock, in the same scenario, if he would have sat out for 10 minutes ? And would Eddie Butler have been gleeful ?. thought we all played under the same rules
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It's a pity that you didn't include a score for the match officials for today's game. This was an old-fashioned Celtic slog - ugly and dull at times. The referee seemed to spot the majority of the Scottish infringements, but much of the Irish ball-killing and spoiling went un-checked. Losing Nathan Hines for 10 minutes was unfortunate, but the late challenge by Chris Patterson on O'Gara that led to BO'D windmilling into the fray in retaliation did not seem to unduly concern any of the match officials. Also, Chris Cusiter's shirt being pulled off his back as he raced back in defense also seemed to drop off the referee's radar.
Similarly, the Welsh and Italians had a third side to play over in Rome, where some blatantly poor adjudication contributed to a chaotic and untidy match. Why on earth did the referee allow the kick for touch in the dying moments? He was asked, and the decision was made. What a way to end an important international sports fixture with chest-poking and arguing.
There were some good quality players out on the parks today, many who played below their best, but the officals need to consider how they can influence a match. Their game needs to be raised for the good of the tournament.
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Re post 53 you obviously have never watched the ABs lose a game of rugby with any kiwis, they take every little thing as a personal insult to them and their country, wonderful people and a quite beautiful country it is but dont diss the ABs
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No nails left on my fingers from that one. Scrappy. Agressive. Not the best Irish performance. Thought the ratings were fair. I really did not think that any player on either side really distinguished themselves. Though cant beloeve so many people are dissing O'Driscoll. The bursting runs, the chip kicks into dead space, the fast switch passes. I thought BOD had a pretty good game and controlled things from the centre pretty well. The thing is that most of what he does is split second decision-making along with a fast delivery and we almost never quite see his impact.
Its a bit like Leamy and Easterby. You have to watch really carefully to see their true impact. Easterby was everywhere yesterday and pulled off some great tackles and turn-overs. And this is praise indeed from an Ulsterman who thinks Neil Best should be starting every game!
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I was very dissapointed with the match, yesterday Ireland were dreadful and so were Scotland, but when Scotland got into that 18-13 lead i was sure they would win. Ireland showed how ordinary they are away from home, its hilarious that people are billing them to take on the All Blacks. If Ireland were playing Scotlnd yesterday with a fullteam they would have won by atleast 30 points.
They won off a charged down try yesterday i would hardly call that a solid away performance, anyway they deserved the triple crown but not the championship.
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Domingo - Post 55
If we all play under the same rules then Ireland should have had a penalty for the late (and blind side) swinging-arm hit on O'Gara that sparked the aggression from O'Driscoll and D'arcy, However the ref did us a favour there, as from the subsequent passage of play and interception, ROG strolled over for the try.
Scotland were poor and attempted to reduce Ireland to that level and then operate the penalties on top of it....which came back to bite them big-style on the behind in the later stages of the game.
Ireland were never in any real danger of being denied the Triple Crown and walked off worthy winners of same at the final whistle.
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Thought the game was exciting but scrappy and no matter what you couldn't take your eyes off it. The fact there were a couple of scraps meant at least Scotland were up for it. Don't agree Ireland deserved it, Scotland GAVE them all their points and outscored them when down to 14 men. Scotland dominated Ireland in the second half outscoring them 12-6. Referee was very poor, actually penalised Hines for not rolling away while Hines was telling him he couldn't because his legs were trapped AND missed three clear forward passes. Gave penalties to both sides for not rolling away too quickly in my opinion when clearly both teams players were trying their best to get out of the way. But at the end of the day Ireland won, and that's what'll be recorded. And if any team deserved to win something this season it's been Ireland.
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Scotland's spoiling made Ireland look better than they were, Hickey getting MOTM because he made one strong tackle was an injustice, Lamont sprinted at least 60 yards to put him in touch - now that was worth MOTM by this game's standards when you consider his all round performance. And what's all this about who choked who ? The Irish should look at their own nasty, cynical little fouls before pointing fingers at a team who emulated their own tactics and showed them how not to choke under pressure. The world cup will be won by a southerm hemisphere team again - we on this side have not come far enough to carry the competition consistently
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In terms of scoring it was 1 nil to Ireland.
I think Ireland played to Scottish limits and did just enough to grind out the win. It can go either way in a cup game. The blacks wont be silly enough to think they can batter Ireland, kinda like the Irish thinking they can destroy, yesterday was Ireland's day and no Scottish fan can justify feeling robbed by it, after all its not like Ireland restarted and caught a 50/50 ball and broke through a sleeping defensive line to win by 3 points in injury time after been behind the majority of the game.
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All this rubbish about Ireland were poor today, you are only as good as a team allows you to be and in this case I think the Scots forwards beat them up just like they did with the Welsh. The Scots have a good pack of forwards Im sure the Irish forwards would attest to this.
Ireland are good when their forwards are rampaging forward setting a platform for their talented backs.
Didn't happen against the Scots. As to Scotland I don't think they are that far away from being a decent team, their backs are definitely the problem though.
Paterson needs to get more involved he is quite devestating in attack, though needs support when he makes his one break a game.
Sean Lamont too is a great runner and his defense is getting better.
His brother also impressed when he got on, Parks and Di Rollo need to be binned though.
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Here here haroldschris. As an Irishman I wholeheartedly concurr! These ridiculous outbursts by some Irish supporters towards legitimate criticism is small-minded, and unfortunately smacks of an inferiority complex. Arrogance similarly masks a lack of self-esteem.
I think we were very poor against Scotland and just about deserved the win.
We were far too slow out of the blocks against France, giving them a 10-3 head-start. However, I believe France have been made look good so far in the Six Nations! They were hockeyed by the All-Blacks at home in november and I don`t see them beating this New Zealand side at the World Cup.
If we are to have any chance against New Zealand we will have to play with the intensity which we showed against them last summer, against Australia in november and England at Croke Park. High- intensity on a consistent basis is the key, as England showed at the last World Cup.
Well done to the Italians yesterday and hopefully England can do us
(and themselves) a favour today. France are talented but definately not unbeatable!
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All credit to the Scots for lifting themselves..Without looking at a pass completed stat I swear I saw Dan Parks kick all but 3 of the balls fed to him, would have been good to see him feed it wide more often..as a fairly senior side with plenty caps between them you want to see more, where are the ball players in Scotland? Having said that they prevented scoring in the opening minutes which would have made for a very different game..Ireland expects and the weight of expectation and tag of favourites remains fairly new to them..
World class..? Quality all over the park to the man but with average performers at fullback and the 2 props..Leamy..mmm, not convinced by this fellow.
A Saffa..watching a lot of Super rugby (super 14) and enjoying the Six Nations..
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Let's get the O'Driscoll-Paterson incident straight. O'Driscoll retaliated to a late strong-arm challenge on O'Gara. Paterson's lucky the ref didn't see his initial challenge or the penalty would've been the other way. But as O'Driscoll put it there was nothing malicious in the game. If you can stand a bit of physical handbags, take up chess.
All this O'Driscoll bashing is irritating me. He was world class again yesterday. Sniping breaks in no space, huge tackles, rallying from the front. No, he's not a God, post 14, but he's the finest back in world rugby today.
Can Ireland beat NZ on that form? Definitely not. That was a very cocky performance from a team trying too hard to be something they're not. Keep it simple and take your points. Gaps will open up once a team is already beaten.
Finally, my man of the match? Lamont. Every time he got his hands on the ball you knew he was very dangerous. Physical, strong, quick - great athlete.
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Ireland did not play especially well, nor especially badly. They started well, but were dragged down by the Scots' excellent defence and dubious tactics in the ruck. The Scotland team, inferior man for man, needed a scrappy, messy game in order to compete. Unfortunately Ireland were unable, for large parts of the game, to overcome these tactics. They created chances, but failed to finish. But, in the end, they won.
Where does this leave Ireland's development? It is good that chances were created, and also that victory was secured. It was disappointing that promising breaks came to nothing. It wasn't a vintage performance, nor a disaster.
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I think the dogged display by Scotland exposed a lot of frailties in the Irish pack. Ireland are great going forward but don't look too clever when they're under pressure.
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Have I missed a change in rules???? Have clothes lines now become acceptable???
Petulant Patterson...
Get a grip you winging sweaty socks...
BOD took the decision like the man he is. Bad performance from Ireland, who were never allowed play. Are the comments from the Welsh game regarding the breakdown still affecting Ireland? Scotland should of had at least two binings, having being warned.
Regarding the choking, WHY LIE, when its not in our makeup...
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A poor game by any standards.
Scotland just didn't seem to have the belief in their ability and lacked ideas and real penetration (bar one or two good moves) when they had possession.
Ireland were very flat and painfully slow. They seemed to be suffering a hangover from the intensity of the England game and never seemed to get the ball wide where they could have punished the Scots. They had almost 70% of possession and territory and barely scraped through. Not good enough.
Ireland need to be consistent if they are to do any way as well in the World Cup and that isn't happening at this stage. I suppose grinding out a win when you're having a bad day is progress but we have to have less bad days.
It possibly is a measure of where they want to be that winning a third Triple Crown in four years doesn't spark the wild celebrations it would have many years ago but still there is a lot of work to be done.
Finally on the matter of O'Driscoll lashing out at Paterson; he was wrong to do it and he knew it and he accepted his punishment. His only question to the ref was "Only Me?" because what he did was purely a reaction to a cheap shot by Paterson who whacked O'Gara from behind after the whistle had gone and play had stopped. If some of the Scots are going to criticise O'Driscoll then at least have the balance to acknowledge Paterson's part in the incident. Otherwise it just sounds like sour grapes.
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Fair play to the scots for dictating how the game was played yesterday and narrowly losing a tight match. Ireland didn't perform well at all (i'm irish) a maybe just deserved the win. But we are definitley due crticism because we played poorly. Any fellow irish men complaining about "anti-irish" sentiment should grow up. We managed to win a scrappy messy game and for that we should be happy. However most of the criticisms I read here have been pretty fair. We need to do a lot more work before the RWC to even hope to get to the semis. Now i'm just waiting for honest tim to post because his comments are always good for a laugh. England to beat France by 3!!!
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Given all the talk before this match of "woeful Scotland" and "amazing Ireland" I have to say this match did not show a gulf in class. Had Scotland beaten Italy last week then Im sure they would have had the confidence to see this match out at 18-13. As it is it wasnt to be and I wish Ireland all the best in their push for the title, hopefully we can do you a favour next week.
With regards to the more arrogant members of your support however might I point out that on current form France are considerably superior and you cant have it both ways - either you were lucky against Scotland as France were against you, aor as I believe the sign of the better side is the one who gains the result which would make France deserved winners against you (as you were yesterday).
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Lets get one thing straight. The refereeing was worth about a 6-9 point swing to Ireland. Pearson's display was poor. Stringer fed just about every scrum and Ireland were in trouble in the scrum for most of the game. There was stamping and raking of Scottish players at virtually every ruck. At one point Hines was was binned for having his head kicked in. Virtually all the Irish forwards and Stringer were guilty. Ireland also stopped fair release on at least as many occasions as Scotland but were pinged far less often and never had men even threatened with binning.
At the end of the match Pearson deprived Scotland of at least 2 kickable penalties.
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Completely agree with the Lamont posters. think he's the real class that Scotland have in the backs. Has been a different class all tournament.
Your centres were just shredded by the Ireland runners and don't look up to it apart from knowing how to tackle.
I'm confused because Ireland didn't learn from those first breaks through midfield or they would have kept attacking there. Instead they got drawn into a ruckfest which was rather ugly actually.
No matter, a win, a triple crown, and with some help from England today, perhaps still a championship.
As for WC chances, i hope it's a case of raising their game fot the ones that really matter (France and Argentina)
Obviously, would like consistent class performances but don't thin we're there yet.
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Pearson was poor! As is becoming the norm with English refs- eg Spreadbury -they are more interested in their own profile than of keeping their heads down and getting the important calls right.
There is very little comment about the Ronan O'G incident- Scotland have been quick to deny it without investigating it! It must have been one of the Irish team who did it then!
And Patterson's cheap shot on O'Gara which led to O'D's retalition.
Scotland aren't as bad a team as has been made out. Nor are Ireland as good as has been made out.
But at the moment the results suggest that Ireland are better than England, Scotland and Wales so just accept it!
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North1.... Stop crying like a girl. You think the scots were angels????
The Scots defence was good and they caused alot of trouble in the scrums which was a problem as there were so many Irish knock-ons.
But Ireland were very poor. I'm Irish and I'm never sure which team is going to turn up. On their day they can beat anyone but they dont have the killer instinct that other BIG teams do. I worry about our lack of consitency in the world cup but more immediately about Italy. If we play there like we did in Murrayfield we will loose. At the moment the italian are better than the Scots.
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A difficult game for Ireland yesterday - as it always is at Murrayfield. Credit to the Scots for the fire in their forwards.
BOD - if he was a Scot, Welsh, English, Italian, French or evan an All Black he would be first on the teamsheet - so no good sniping against him. I like the fact he gets stuck in and swings a few handbags. It's good to have a captain the team will follow into battle.
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Congratulations to Ireland on their Triple Crown. They have achieved the most creditable results among the home nations since the last RWC.
Disappointed with O'Sullivan's comments about O'Gara being "choked". I seem to remember he he made scathing comments about Corry's claims concerning eye-gouging in Dublin. O'Gara himself seems to want to let the matter go. Mr. O'Sullivan now sounds somewhat of a hypocrite.
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I thought it was a terrible match.
Scotland were cynical all day....obviously terrified to leave the irish play....
How many times did we see scots lying on the ball preventing fast ball for Ireland??
Ireland lacked the clynical precision that we were expecting and also looked a fairly average side; although they never looked like losing the match.
I thought the ref was useless too, lots of bad calls, for both sides, throughout the match.
Scotland are a bit of a bogey team for Ireland and i'm glad we managed to come away with the win. Scotland always force the game to be played at their level making it dificult for teams to put them away. Having said that Ireland are good enough to and should have put at least 30 points on such an average side.
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What is the point of a rating system of 0 to 10 if only four numbers ever get used? Why not just say everyone was pretty average?
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Ronan O' Gara Choking Incident:-
Having watched the TV replays I think it shows John Hays arm around Ronan O'Gara's neck? It's a very serious charge Eddie O'Sullivan is levelling and perhaps a bit foolish.
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Hi Mark,
I would not agree with your rating of the Irish palyers, at all.. hence, here is my Irish Team Rating :
GIRVAN DEMPSEY 8
The most accomplished Irish performer in the backs. With confidence levels off the chart, Dempsey looked assured in everything he did (bar one difficult pass he failed to hold). His incursions into the line were intelligently angled and well-timed while, in defence,
SHANE HORGAN 5
It has been a season of superlatives for Horgan and yesterday, though eager as ever, it just didn't come off for the leviathan wide man. His appetite for the ball was ravenous but there were too many errors.
BRIAN O'DRISCOLL 7
The Scottish midfield is not in the same league and O'Driscoll, like his troops, seemed to have trouble adjusting mentally to a game Ireland were expected to win by a landslide. One superb shimmy right at the end led to a break that should have resulted in the match-clinching score.
GORDON D'ARCY 7
Every time D'Arcy touches the ball he puts Ireland on the front foot. At his best when negating the Scottish centres, his trick of conjuring space out of the midfield morass was evident yesterday and is a vital ingredient in Ireland's recipe for World Cup achievement.
DENIS HICKIE 7
Any question-marks regarding gas levels as the Hickie chassis depreciates with age were dispelled conclusively by his wondrous chase back and tackle on Chris Paterson. Pace wasn't the problem for 'the try that wasn't' when he should have gone, ahem, bald-headed for the corner.
RONAN O'GARA 6
Looked like he was playing to a gameplan in the first-half revolving around high-tempo, change-of-direction rugby. Did that job well, but when it failed to punish Scotland on the scoreboard, it should have been abandoned for a Plan B based on territory and toil. There was also some loose kicking from Ireland's playmaker. However, O'Gara's mental strength shone through in the decisive last act.
PETER STRINGER 6
His service was not as slick as we have become accustomed to, but that was directly attributable to the Scottish policy of slowing down Irish possession, by whatever means. His covering was as exemplary as it always is, notably one superb tackle on Lamont. Remains the crucial link man for Ireland - we know what happens when he does not play.
DENIS LEAMY 6
For such an effective tackler, the amount of times he covers anorexic blindsides that are never going to see the ball is disconcerting. Increased his influence after half-time and battled right to the end to ensure the unthinkable did not come to pass.
DAVID WALLACE 6
With the Scots hell-bent on spoiling Irish ball, the old chestnut of Wallace not being a nose-to-the-ground openside became relevant again. However, as in the case of Horgan, Wallace is a class act.
SIMON EASTERBY 8
Ireland's best forward. He was everywhere. He took it up with relish, claimed his lineouts, pummelled every Scot on his radar and supported and linked superbly for O'Gara's try.
PAUL O'CONNELL 7
Started like a train, flinging himself around Murrayfield like a backrow and O'Connell handled the ball more in the first quarter than he had in the entire championship prior to yesterday. Had his work cut out dealing with a commited Scottish eight.
DONNCHA O'CALLAGHAN 6
Ireland's 'scrapper' had a rare old tussle with the Scots, and his opposite number. Good solid performance, but must improve.
JOHN HAYES 7
Solid is the adjective most regularly attached to Hayes and this was another performance to be filed in the solidity folder. A couple of shaky scrums but nothing to fret over and whenever the Scots drove in his direction they met a roadblock.
RORY BEST 7.5
Hit his men in the lineout and hit his men around the park. Jerry Flannery should probably start next week against Italy but Best's development since November means, whoever wears No 2 in the World Cup, Eddie O'Sullivan knows he is well covered in this crucial area. Two lineouts went astray but Best turned in another impressive all-round performance.
SIMON BEST 5
Unlike his brother, Simon knows he is back-up (at best) if Hayes and Horan are fit. In the unfamiliar loose-head role, he battled away but did not cause the opposition any undue worry. Bryan Young is a better option as understudy prop.
REPLACEMENTS
Jerry Flannery (5) - Missed a bad tackle on Lamont and, though commited as always, Flannery needs to start a few matches in succession to finally banish his injury cobwebs and the talk of 'second-season syndrome'.
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I thought the game was exciting. Classic Ireland v. Scotland encounter - sure not many line breaks and plenty of errors, but then your had two nations of renowned mentalists battering each other, so you can't expect everything. Ireland only played as well as Scotland let them and there are loads of other teams who have built big reputations on a limited game plan. Anyone ever watched Argentina? Or Italy for that matter?
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I actually enjoyed watching Ireland trying to play some rugby against a very boring Scottish side. just one of those days when things went wrong at the last minute but a wins a win. Scotland play like Ireland of old spoilers, can be affective on its day but usually ends in tears. Ireland arent doing to bad for a small player base and do try to play exciting rugby.
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I actually enjoyed watching Ireland trying to play some rugby against a very boring Scottish side. just one of those days when things went wrong at the last minute but a wins a win. Scotland play like Ireland of old spoilers, can be affective on its day but usually ends in tears. Ireland arent doing to bad for a small player base and do try to play exciting rugby.
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Wooo hooo!!! Well done England! I love it! Roll on St. Paddy's Day!!!
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While there was much controversy on WalesVItaly last seconds of the game yesterday, when kicking to touch in the last ten seconds.Nothing has been said about Scotland in the final time overlap were awarded a penalty which they were not allowed to take. I thought if you were awarded a penalty that you wer obliged to take it even if time has run out. If they had been allowed to take the penalty and were successful, they could have won the game.
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At the end of the Scotland Ireland game the ref blew his whistle indicating a penalty to Scotland and then immidiately blew for time. Is that what I saw? He defo raise his arm on Scotlands side. If it was I can't ever recall a penalty being awarded at the end of a game and then no opportunity being given to play it. Paterson may well have kicked it and won the game.
As for the Wales penalty...have you ever heard the TMO calling time on a game and not the ref?
What is going on in the game these days?
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Roll on next Saturday .... all set up for a perfect way to end the Six Nations and the ideal way to spend St Paddy's day .... lets see if Ireland can play like the team that we all know and love and rise to the challenge of pinning back Italy and making sure that the points are on the board ....
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All in all your ratings are fair. I have to say though that Marcus Di Rollo had a very ordinary game. I believe had he and Dewey put in half decent performances the outcome would have been different. Maybe the fact that they were playing against the best centre combination in the world had something to do with it...
Even so, I believe the middle field battle was the key area yesterday - and Ireland came out on top.
P.S Could Scotland stop this horrendous pick and drive they seem to want to do at every occasion.
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Is it just me, or is di Rollo completely inefective in every game he plays? Ultimately, Scotland only have a few decent players so get Lamont in the centre with Dewey..what a great pairing and put Walker or ideally Webster (if he's fit) out on the wing. di Rollo doesn't even deserve an Edinburgh shirt, he's appalling!
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Oh dear. Sam Fuller, I'm not saying that Scottish players are angels. They clearly aren't. I'm saying 2 things. 1) Ireland are nothing like as good as they are bucked up to be. They have adequate half backs, good wings and full backs and 2 outstanding centres. The Irish pack, however is rather ordinary.
2) Dave Pearson was a very poor referee on yesteday's showing. He seemed to take the field with the attitude that Ireland deserved to win and then refereed the game on that basis. Persistent Irish fouls were ignored for most of the 1st half and largely ignored for much of the 2nd half. Despite that Scotland won enough penalties to be in the lead with 10 mins. to go.
Irish players continually stamped and raked Scottish players; crossing, forward passes and 'feeding' the scrum were the norm for most of the game. At the end of the game Pearson gave a very soft penalty against Taylor, ignored a clear case not releasing against an Irish player and refused Scotland a chance to kick 1 last penalty which he had blown up for before the end of the game. Catruiona and David, above, both refer to this incident.
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Why have people talked about patterson's swinging arm and bo'driscoll's punch and not mentioned the disgusting behaviour by Hogg. Remember the end of the match? Remember the Irish player on the ground? Hogg put him there with an off-the-ball punch. Watch the last 2 minutes
of the match again if you have it recorded. He should be cited.
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Ratings pretty much spot-on after what was an awful match. I would like to make a point that doesn't seem to have been made anywhere yet - the booing, whistling and general noise-making every time O'Gara had a kick at goal was nothing short of disgusting. Someone even sounded an air horn each time Ronan went to kick. This was not a minority of fans making this noise either - thousands were at it. Come on guys - grow up.
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Glad someone gave O'G a 6; England have snapped up the stand-off Ireland could do with (I think his older brother has opted for Ireland?) - ratings are probably fair but this isn't the World Cup Veterans Tournamnet coming up - where was Trimble etc to add a bit of fizz to the old men?
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Can't believe Scotland are getting so much credit for the way they play. They have such a lack of ability and negative, boring approach to rugby they have an uncanny ability to make the beautiful game dull.
Fair enough their back row and locks are average to good and keep them competitive but the lack of talent in the rest of the team make them a real bore to watch.
Any team including Spain could approach rugby with the one-dimensional aim of stopping the other team playing. The difficult part is developing an attacking threat while maintaining a strong defense. Since Hadden has come to the helm Scotland have not created one decent try, save for a missed tackle or piece of luck.
Patterson is an excellent goal kicker and he is the only reason they have managed to maintain this play for penalties mentality.
There were 6 or 7 penalties on the trot in the first half where Scotland killed the ball at the breakdown against Ireland. This is unacceptable in an international game and will be made clear to the referee for the game against France next week and Scotland will not be so lucky. I expect France to expose this one-dimensional Scottish team next week and put 40-50 points on them.
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I blame the referee, he completey lost control over the game in the first five minutes. There were three or four off the ball punch ups before the O'Driscoll fight (he should have been sin binned for retaliation if nothing else. The Irish forwards were consistently offside at the rucks and mauls and when Paterson was tackled close to the line two Irish forwards dived over the top. They did not stay on their feet and prevented the ball from being collected by Scotland. Result should have been a penalty to Scotland 5 yards from the Irish line but Paterson was penalised for holding on. I have now watched three matches at Murrayfield this season and haven't seen a decent referee yet.
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I think any team with an eye to winning a WC would need to put a team like Scotland to the sword regardless of conditions, negative play et al.
Maybe the Irish team - like their fans - are starting to believe their own hype. i hope not as it would be nice to see all the teams from the NH having a good go at the guys down under.
Keith Wood said that Scotland gifted Ireland all their points. Oh dear!
As for the ROG thing, how anyone can rate him as 'World Class' completely bewilders me. Maybe in the NH he could make the top 3 but that's about it. I think the Fly half EOS would love to have came on for England as a sub today in the victory over France.
What are the odds on Italy beating Ireland? I can't put into words how much i will laugh if that happens. There's coming down to earth with a bump and there's a crash landing.
Cut price parachutes anyone?
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A match full of errors, Ireland really have to sort out their handling too many spilled passes or knock ons in great scoring positions.
Have to say though scotland are the wimbledon of rugby, beside Lamont maybe patterson they have no ability in the backline. They play the borinest rugby I have every watched. IReland play good rugby but scotland once again brought another team down to their level.
Its very difficult on the eye, but if that helps them keep the score down, they never looked like winning though even when they were 5 points up with 15mins to go.
Horgan is playing bad at the moment a should be dropped.
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Oh come on folks, Ireland did not turn up on Saturday, they never got out of first gear and had a woeful display. A team that can do that and still win doesn't have too much to worry about. We got another 4 gears to play with.
As for the match, terrible game, made for terrible viewing.
Scotland were offside the entire game, was the Ref part scottish ?
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Having been in Edinburgh for the game and on reading the comments on this thread I have to say I detect an element of arrogance about Irish rugby at the moment....'Scotland cheated', 'Scotland brought the Irish down to their level', 'Ireland were always going to win', etc. Scotland are not world beaters at the moment but one thing they did achieve on Saturday was to dispel the misconception that Ireland are anything other than a good, solid rugby team. It's not so long that an Irish win at Murrayfield would have been considered nothing short of a miracle....perhaps a dose of reality needs taken and people recognise that a victory of any sort should still be viewed as a very useful achievement.
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Some of you Irish lads are being a little ungenerous in your comments. I think you all expected an easy day with plenty of Irish tries and while you may it down to Ireland having a bad day, the fact is that Scotland quite simply stopped Ireland from showing what they can do and exposed some weaknesses in the process. The Irish front row creaked all day and even when Scotland were down to 7 in the scrum they were under no presure. I know Hayes is a big cult figure in Ireland and has some admirable qualities, he is simply no scummager, and Best is certainly no threat to Horan either. cast your mind back to Dublin last year and the Scots did exactly the same, Ireland's only try in those games came from a charged down kick. Ireland have scored plenty of tries against everyone else, so credit to Scotland for conceding nothing. I can't believe the poster who said he was never worried about the eventual outcome, Ireland were one kick away from defeat and it would not have been agreat injustice had they lost.I thought the Ref was reasonably ok but cant understand, leaving aside who started it, how he can penalise O'Driscoll for a punch and not card him, then card Hines when he's trapped in a ruck with no chance of rolling away. Scotland, i believe are heading in the right direction, the pack are able to compete with anyone,but we still have big problems at 10 and 13 which do not appear to have easy answers, we have made ourselves very difficult to beat but need to find a way to create more which is very hard without the players to fill those jerseys.Do bear in mind that Scotland had 6 players in the line up who had never played 6N Rugby before this season.Be patient, better days are ahead.
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WHY IS DI ROLLO STILL BEING PICKED ??????
How many opportunities will he be given to show that he is not international class. I'm afraid that Hadden is beggining to look like a third rate coach with his baffling selection on this player alone. We will never offer any attacking form with a player who can't catch, pass or run with the ball. Park is excusable due to lack of options but Di Rollover has offered nothing in his 20 odd caps.
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Well immediately after the match I had a lot of sympathy for Scottish supporters as the team were unfortunate to lose an evenly-contested game. After reading most of the entries on here I have changed my view, as most of you are bitter, bitter people who can't take losing with grace. To rub salt into your wounds, we managed to win the game without playing anywhere near what we're capable of. You are a terrible rugby team & most of your booing fans are a disgrace. Enjoy getting a 50 point hammering in Paris in your last game.
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Scotland have no talent in the backs?You think Stringer is a better player than Blair or Cussiter?
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"They play the borinest rugby I have every watched... scotland once again brought another team down to their level."
What is "borinest" rugby please?
In all honesty, a team that has pretentions to the RWC should be able to rise above it. Ireland couldn't, and they struggled to break down a very good defence. But for a charge down due to a poorly timed and executed kick from one of the "star" players, Scotland would have won by 6 points. Yes, Scotland were average, but are only a couple of players away from being a good - approaching very good - team.
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So the Scots prepared for the game on Saturday knowing they were outclassed. They correctly decided their only chance of competing was to spoil every quick Irish ball, and take out O'Gara, the danger man. They followed their gameplan with great consistency, right down to the last ruck. But they still lost.
I am re-assured that pure destructiveness and malice are not enough to win a top rugby game. The fans at Murrayfield boo the opposing kickers more loudly than any other home support in the tournament. Their fans on this blog moan about referees and claim to be unlucky. They need to face up to the sad decline of a once proud rugby nation and stop their rapid slide towards mob rule on and off the pitch.
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Some harsh criticism of Scotland here from some Irish. Sounding a bit bitter that the Irish didn't perform very well on Saturday.
Ireland have a better side than Scotland but we played the right sort of game and should have been more disciplined near the end and got the win. Taylor was a bit lazy to get caught offside - silly mistake really.
Patterson and BOD should both have been penalised for their handbags - the player that retaliates will always be more likely to get punished - BOD would have known this.
The slowing down of ball is as much an Irish trait as it was a Scottish one on Saturday - even the All Blacks do it. It's just a question of whether you get away with it.
Keith Wood called it right - Scotland gifted Ireland their points. Scotland should be pleased with their response after and awful result against Italy - let's hope we'll take a bit of confidence from this game to Paris, where if we play the same France team that showed up against England we'll be in with a chance.
Ireland will be better against Italy, but need to not force the game so much or they might get into another dog fight. I reckon Ireland for the championship cos the Scots will run the French close.
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Poor display from Ireland. Scotland did well to keep us back but for us to play as badly as we did and still win isnt all bad. ireland need to show more consistancy though. i also think that theres a bit of anti irish around. for years we were also branded "underdogs" and now that we have a good side who can win matches even playin badly, people are now calling us lucky. so what if we played at our best on sat and still be scotland? would we still be classed as lucky?
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Ireland need Murphy on the bench. There is no one that can add a spark to a game that needs it. Saturday's game was crying out for a bit of creativeness off the bench and my lord he would've provided it! Reddan, Wallace and Trimble don't offer it unfortunately. England had Geraghty, Perry, Lund, Tait - all can swing a game.
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I love Scottish people and their fans , i have many fond memories of drinking with them watching matches between Ireland and Scotland in the past. But I was disgusted with the booing of O'Gara every Kick he went for those fans should be ashamed. That showed really bad sportsmanship, no excuses for that behaviour.
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As an Irish man I have to say fair play to Scotland for making themselves so hard to beat. Don't forget they beat France and England at home last year. They were undone by a horrendous start against Italy 2 weeks ago. Paterson is the best goalkicker in the NH at the moment. They didn't have the flair to break down Ireland though.
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Scotland were a bit negative, yes, but you play to your strengths. As mentioned a lot, an Irish win in Scotland was as rare as hens teeth. Yes, to come away and be disappointed with only a one point win does show how far we have come but at the same time there is such a thing as being gracious in victory as well as defeat. Scotland rattled us and played the way they played as they knew it was the best they could do with their limited resources (that isn't meant to be patronising, sorry).
Let's put it this way. Ireland vs NZ in the RWC Quarter Final. In order to stop NZ playing, you have to slow the ball down. Once we get it, we have to keep it in the forwards, up the jumper then rely on Penalties and Drop Goals. We win the game by one point but are beaten by 3 tries to none. I would sure as hell take that!
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I'm not sure if I'm the first to say this, but haven't seen anything here, and congratulate John Hayes for his quick thinking in removing ROG's gumshield and placing him in the recovery position. Deserves recognition for that!
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At all levels of the game you will always find matches were a poor side will drag the better side down to their level, however I will concede that it is up to the better side to rise above this, this was not the case on Saturday.
As the final score confirmed, the better side won.
At no point in the game did Scotland threaten to score anything other than a penalty, of which they successfully kicked 6, Ireland on the other hand afforded to miss 2 otherwise kickable penalties and forced a try saving tackle from Lamont which went to the TMO.
Had these possible 13 points been taken, then a 14 point margin win would have been flattering but realistic.
But going back to my earlier point, Scotland would never have scored more than the 6 penalties Ireland gifted them.
The player ratings are therefore fair enough.
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To gfrazer #108 and Roy #111
You're comments themselves are bitter.
I think Scotland played the right sort of game. We don't have the players to throw the ball around - we are working towards that. Paterson at 10 might help.
Playing destructively is perfectly fine, sure it's frustrating but all teams try to slow down the opposition - if you think Ireland don't do this then you're deluded.
For what it's worth I felt it was an even game, I expected a bit more from Ireland but they showed their stregth by stepping it up once they were 5 points down.
As for the booing - you're spot on. It's a disgrace. I'm not sure who these people are but they should be ashamed. They have given the Scottish fans a bad name in recent games - I just hope you'll accept that we are not all like that.
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kjfrazer (post 102)said "What are the odds on Italy beating Ireland? I can't put into words how much i will laugh if that happens."
kj, you are the only person around who manages to take delight in others misfortune. schadenfreude (spelling?) must be your middle name. even ireland have grown beyond that, and referring to england that is something. just grow up. if you can't say something relevant or constructive then don't say anything.
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Pete-dry your eyes will ya!!
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Stephen (119) - Ireland had the most dangerous backs undoubtedly, but to say that Scotland didn't threaten! If Southwell had passed to Paterson instead of shoving the ball up his jumper with a 2 on 1, 5 yards from the line it was a certain try.
I take nothing away from Ireland, they did what they had to when outgunned up front. Worrying for them I suppose that they seemed to run out of ideas in the backs a bit (we expect that from Scotland!) and seemed to panic at times. Although they were composed at the end, keeping the ball and forcing Scotland to give away the winning penalties.
Good luck for the championship.
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How bitter are the Scots?
The posts here are pathetic.
Your team are negative and have absolutely no spark, that is why you lost, not because of the ref or because O'Driscoll smacked Patterson.
In order to win rugby matches you have to occassionally play rugby.
As for us Irish being arrogant, we are not, its just that we have a better rugby team and setup than you at the moment.
Whingers!
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just want to say the o gara incident was horrible to see and however tried to choke him should just come forward and confess. if it was an "accident" then there should be no problem in coming forward should there? fair dues to the scots on this blog page for congratualting us irish. i wish all the scottish fans who boo during the away teams penalties would be as decent.
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Laurence, i can't believe that you are a genuine Irish fan, so go away and grow up.
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I have to say that the incident with Ogara was unfortunate however tell me how you are meant to roll away or release a player when there are 5 or 6 bodies lying on top of you??!! Given that we conceaded at least 2 penalties on Sat for not rolling away I find it totally bemusing that a referee can expect someone to get away from the ball with 40 stone on top of them, impossible! I also think that the incident with O'Driscoll on Saturady merited a yellow card at the very least, however once again the ref bottled it because of who he is. Don't get me wrong O'Driscoll is World class but the rules apply to him as well none the less.Congratulations to Ireland on the win all the same.
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How could somebody free his arms at the bottom of a ruck to 'choke' a player alongside him? Hilarious double standards from the Kings of Choking (Ireland) slagging another team for choking when clearly all that happened was O'Gara was thumped (legally) by Hines and ended up at the bottom of a ruck.
Can someone get O'Driscoll to stop behaving like a petty footballer? What's with all the pestering the referee and 'bravely' slapping players when the ref's out of sight?
As for the amusing 'Laurence' in post 124, the Irish have managed one try in two years v Scotland, and that was a charge down. What's the problem? You boys only able to play rugby when the big nasty opposition let you? Roll on the World Cup and another load of excuses from the Irish . . .
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the ref didn't bin o driscoll because of who he is. there were 2 players involved. i feel that o driscoll has a very clean reputation as a player and is rarely involved in stunts like that- clearly o gara was targetted by patterson and should have gotten ticked off by the ref. and as captain he was trying to stop that altho the temper got the better of him. can someone tell me how someone can be choked accidentally? i'd love to know how putting your hands round and squeezing is classed as accidental
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I have a question, this question comes out of ignorance so please do not take offence if there is an obvious answer
Why is there no Northern Ireland team in the six nations rugby
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Very little has been said about the performance of Dempsey this season. I thought he was one of Ireland's most solid performers on Saturday and he had a lot to do to deal with the Scot's one dimensional tactics. Up to the start of the season I would have always prefered to see Murphy at 15 but now Dempsey is certainly there on merit
I still think there is a role for Murphy. He should be on the bench and I think if he were available to come in Saturday, the game pattern would have suited him. I can't recall whether Trimble got a run in the end or not. O'Sullivan has only space on the bench for utility back and surely Murphy would bring more tactical options than Trimble particularly given his experience. He was awesome for his ten minute stint agaist Wales
Murphy for Trimble anyone?
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re. post #94 timtoe
The battle in the midfield was always going to be tough for the Scots, but too often Dewey seemed to go in too high and the tackles were missed.
Scotland have been criticised on the blog for being negative - but I think we do try to play an open game where appropriate, unfortunately our midfield still lacks any real quality and so therefore we struggle when we try to throw the ball around. Dewey looks good but we don't have good enough number 10 and Di Rollo is just not cutting it at the moment. I'd like to see Scotland bring Paterson to 10, maybe try one of the lamont brothers in the centre or webster if fit.
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To anyone who thinks Ireland didn't deserve to win: simply look at the stats. Ireland made more passes, had more possession and spent more time in the opponent's 22. Only once did Scotland look like scoring a try, and that was from a counter attack when Ireland's defense evidently wouldn't have been organised.
Yes, the Irish display was very disappointing, but there was little or nothing in the Scottish backs to worry Ireland. The poorness of the Irish display was because of mistakes. Mistakes which the Scottish were unable to capitalise on. A good defensive performance is never enough to win a game, as the deserved win for Ireland showed.
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I was at the match in Edinburgh, and agree that it was a pretty average performance for Ireland, and an above average for Scotland.
The match did have its anticipation and excitement at the end, but on the whole, slightly woeful
I got more enjoyment out of a poor Scots supporter, tutting at irelands call and shouting offside or crossing everytime a miss move was done.
Thank you to that sad Scots fan
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Charlie - 1 try in 2 years - what exactly is the point you're trying to make? We played very poorly in both games & still won. The last time we played well against Scotland was in 2003. Even then we were missing some key players & we minced you alive.
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Glad that Cusiter was given a right score this time. Scotland played really well they got closer to anyone else has come to beating the Irish. The boys need to keep up the good work. O'Driscoll was out of order going for Euan Murray who only came in to help Cusiter in splitting up the fight. Yeah he is the best centre but that does not make him prefect and totally untouchable. He should have been sin binned for that!!
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! are ye seriously saying that o driscoll is petty? that's a load of rubbish. he has a very clean good reputation and what about patterson!je was involved too. bloody hell talk about bitterness. we don't make excuses. we admit we didnt play to our full potential but we still won didnt we. also the excuse making from the scottish after the italy game was laughable! don't talk about excuse making. also would like the scottish fans quit their booing tactics, now that is petty!
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Scotland played to what limited strengths they have. For an allegedly World Class side Ireland didn't cope with the spoiling very well, and if they are ever to be a great side they must. O'Sullivan found a very convenient talking point to avoid explaining why his side didn't win by the 20 points that was expected of them. I sympathise with ROG but its difficult to sympathise with some of the lads who seem to go down like skittles in the last ten minutes of the game. You can never be quite certain if they are hurt or just playing the clock.
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Ive been reading a lot of these very bitter posts from ireland fans complaining, rather arrogently i might add, that scotland didnt let ireland play, well surely if your team is as good as you lot seem to think you are they should have been good enough to rise above Scotlands so called "Ordinary team". Shouldnt these posters be asking themselves why couldnt our so called "world class" team find a way to break them down. Or maybe you guys just expect teams to just let you dictate the game, haha. I think you guys were given a real scare at murryfield and are now making excuses for your own team who perhaps are not just as "world class" as you thought you were.
As for Scotland we know we are not the best team in the 6nations yet, however i honestly believe that we are 2 possitions away from having a very good team. Given the age of the team, if we can get paterson going consistantly at 10 and find a good outside centre then the future could be very promising.
P.S.
Mr Hadden, why do you persist with di rollo as he offers absoloutly nothing!!
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georgegraham, good argument. I think you re-read the rubbish of you and your compatriots before accusing other people of being childish. I don't get into slagging matches with proper rugby fans but todays posts from most of the scots are shameful.
Charlie, 'Kings of the Chokers' What on earth are you talking about? Oh and good come back with the 'only one try in two years'. We still won both games, in fact when was the last time you won a match against us?
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douglasthe reason there is no northern irish team is because the northern irish players play for ireland. unlike the football/soccer situation there in no northern ireland in rugby. all players from the 4 provinces ulster leinster munster and sometimes connacht play on an all ireland team. it's great as players from all politicial persuasions play as irish. hence the 2 national anthems.
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Brain O'Driscoll may be a good player but he is not a walking man-god and should remember that he is not above being tackled or above the laws of the game.
He is not only idolised by himself but many young players not just in Ireland but the world over and should set a better example with his discipline and conduct towards referees.
To continue acting like this will marr a great rugby career.
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I thought Ireland were awfull!! But, deserved to win because Scotland were worse! To suggest Scotland were unlucky because they did'nt gift 3 tries like last time is silly. That stats of the match all back up an Irish win, even if seem to do their best to throw it away! On the ratings, I think you're being overly generous to ROG. An average goal kicking display, poor kicking from hand (again) & poor in general play.
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Charlie 128 'the Irish have managed one try in two years v Scotland, and that was a charge down.' It's very telling you don't go back further... if you included 05 it would be 6 tries.... add 04 onto that & we're up to 11...
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After reading some rubbish on this forum I just have to say when the irish bubble bursts I really do think the entire northern hemisphere will laugh for a week.
ose a game.
I wonder what the odds of Ireland having to qualify for the WC 2011 if the argies and the french just destroy your scrum.
Finally ireland made Gavin kerr look good. Really top class guys you got out scrummed by Kerr.
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I think we know as does he that it was Ross Ford with his arm around O'Gara neck. He is lucky that munster don't have too play Borders again this season. Ford have quite a problem with his discipline, May need to watch himself.
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The citing commissioner has found nothing untoward after extensive analysis of all video footage....what happens now? a public apology from EOS or perhaps some legal action for his slanderous and unfounded allegations?
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the whole choker thing is getting so much mileage at the moment it is really too much.
Brian moore must be really enjoying this.
Anyway how many grand slam showdowns did England blow under Sir Clive before finally winning in Landsdowne Road in 2003?
we all had a go at frustrating England over that period (we enjoyed it too) and I was at the games in Lansdowne in 2001 & 2003 - the infamous "red carpet" affair.
I takes a good team to win a slam and a lot has to go right to do it.
That was a great result for England over the weekend and anyone who cares about the 6 nations wants 6 strong teams in the competition. Where Wales go from here is a big question and how Scotland sort out their domestic game is a major problem.
So lets hear it for the 6 nations and lets try to keep the RWC in Europe.
allez les bleus
Leinster that is!
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ok well first of all can i just say little bit of deja vu!
i mean were lamont and paterson the only ones awake in this game, just like two weeks ago? i was there at the last match and my dad and i nearly left half way through it was so embarassing, kinda wish we did now cos our train was so late. it was just not worth it, we had driven up from wales for that game.
granted this game was better. the defence held and thank god we brought back parks but really why do they all go to sleep as soon as they get some points on the board.
also i can't believe it was left up to lamont to run the width of the pitch to stop hickie when there were two other scotland players on his sholder. get it together boys
i think that paterson's scoring was on form as usual as were parks kicks and there was some spirit shown from the lamont boys but apart from these guys the rest was a loss. really get rid of di rollo.
all said and done we must still congratulate the team on managing to keep the score to 19-18(or rather paterson), but not let it go to our heads as really this score was only achieved through the sloppy play from ireland though both teams had their good momments!!!!
well thatnk you for giving me the chance to rant a bit as say i just hope that next week the team is a bit more awake as france WILL NOT be push overs and it is on their teritory.
good luck boys!!
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Just like to say I've come across bad losers in my time but never winners as bad as the Irish!!! Face facts you played your socks off on Saturday and were lucky to scrape a 1 point win. The score flattered you. The score also highlighted that you are light years behind teams like the ABs and in reality are more equally matched to the likes of Scotland, Wales and England. The French are far superior and you were not unlucky to lose against them you were stupid to assume that you had the game in the bag before the final whistle blew. I laughed so hard I almost split my sides! As for the attempted murder of ROG my you Irish at least appear to have a sense of humour although if I'm honest it was lacking on Saturday in Edinburgh. The Welsh could teach you a thing or two about mixing with the locals and having a great time while accepting both victory and defeat with a bit of humility.
p.s Please please please please please get Stringer a pair of shorts that fit him as if I have to watch him play shoe-horned into a pair of hotpants again I'll hurl!!!
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On the whole choking thing...I think EOS spoke in the heat of the moment..but he did also describe the Scots as "honourable" and said that the incident was out of character for the game.
Rugby has always been a game where players have policed situations more than referees...it seems that this is still the case...it does not excuse O'Driscoll, but he was reacting to a, dare I say "dirty" hit on O'Gara.
This has been an interesting 6N's...nobody has totally dominated...not even the French. I do not think it is a clear indicator of how any of these teams will perform in the RWC.
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can i say scotland has been cleared of the offence an if you look at the replay no scotland player in near the throat of o'gara so where did the irish get he was chocked he was crushed under the wieght of bodys on top of him i feel the irish coach should say sorry to the scottish team
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I said here last week that I was a little worried that Saturday might have been a repeat of 2001 for Ireland. In the end it was rather too close to that for comfort. Still, we did win and after decades of watching 'moral victories' for Ireland in games where the other side scored more points I will settle for that. I'm also puzzled by the fairly widespread opinion that Scotland deserved to win. The statistics suggest otherwise, as no.132 has shown. The view stems, I suggest,merely from the pre-match assumptions that Ireland would win easily being unfulfilled. Scotland were dogged but limited. Just like many Irish sides of the 80s and 90s.
Looking forward to Saturday, pessimist that I am, I worry about the absence of O'Connell. To be champions I think we will need a 25 point margin at least against Italy (and that is taking a conservative view of what France might do to Scotland). I don't see them doing that given the confidence-boost Italy have had.
Finally, the staggered starting times will give France a big advantage, as they will know from the start exactly what they have to do. (Same applies even more so to England but I dont want to contemplate them beating Wales by 50!)
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I said here last week that I was a little worried that Saturday might have been a repeat of 2001 for Ireland. In the end it was rather too close to that for comfort. Still, we did win and after decades of watching 'moral victories' for Ireland in games where the other side scored more points I will settle for that. I'm also puzzled by the fairly widespread opinion that Scotland deserved to win. The statistics suggest otherwise, as no.132 has shown. The view stems, I suggest,merely from the pre-match assumptions that Ireland would win easily being unfulfilled. Scotland were dogged but limited. Just like many Irish sides of the 80s and 90s.
Looking forward to Saturday, pessimist that I am, I worry about the absence of O'Connell. To be champions I think we will need a 25 point margin at least against Italy (and that is taking a conservative view of what France might do to Scotland). I don't see them doing that given the confidence-boost Italy have had.
Finally, the staggered starting times will give France a big advantage, as they will know from the start exactly what they have to do. (Same applies even more so to England but I dont want to contemplate them beating Wales by 50!)
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I watched the match in a pub in Edinburgh.It was exciting stuff and unsure until the final whistle. The Scots played well, as I would have expected them to do after the Italy match. All the fans I spoke to enjoyed the game, and the celebrations went on from both sides supporters. Maybe not the game I was expecting from Ireland, but very entertaining for it.
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Eddie O' Sullivan realised that he has no strength in depth. O'Gara was sparko'ed by a huge, legal tackle. If concussion is detected he'll have to sit out the Italy match. With no O'Connell, O'Driscoll carrying a dodgy hammy and another couple of 1st choice player a bit bashed up, he doesn't want to lose the man that will keep Ireland going. If he does they are sunk.
EOS called England out of line over the JW incident before Croke. The accusation of opposition players trying to almost kill another player is sickening. If EOS is trying to cover up concussion for ROG to play, he is endangering his players life, he should be asked to put his hand up and admit it. But is he a reasonable fella?
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What a day Saturday could be! Bring on the Italians on Paddys day! Oh and Scotland please try to keep the score down in Paris!!
I wud put Leo Cullen or Bob Casey in at lock with O'Connell injured as I believe neither Mick O'Driscoll or Trevor Hogan are up to international standard. MOD sits on the bench for every Munster heineken cup match for gods sake!
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The citing commissioner has found no evidence of foul play in the O'Gara incident. That is no surprise. EOS himself said there would be no video evidence because the cameras missed it. The lack of video evidence does not mean it didn't happen. We'll never really know whether it was a deliberate act or an accident. But calls for apologies from the Irish are misplaced and show a total lack of understanding of the citing process.
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I agree with Richie, I would put Leo Cullen in ahead of O'Driscoll, who's style, I my option is a throw back to the amateur days. Cullen has been an outstanding performer in the Guinness premiership this year and would be a perfect replacment for Ireland against the Italian style of play.
He should be there on Merit. As for Bob Casey, I think EOS would put stringer in the row before he picked Bob.
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There was no video evidence because it didn't happen.
To say a lack of video eveidence doesn't mean it didn't happen is absurd.
The collission that whacked ROG was on national TV as was everything that followed, it was not off the ball , he had the ball and was involved in a ruck.
ROG is suffering concussiona and the irish are palying a bit smart. Nobody saw it happen, there were 23 Irish Arsene Wengers out there quite clearly.
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I'd just like to add my five pence to this convo. First up, I actually really enjoyed the game, felt it was a real see-saw as to who would win. Congratulations to the Irish, a win is a win. Secondly this Blog seemed to be aimed at marking the players, not questioning who deserved to win and who didn't.
I have found the petty squabling and lack of sporting/ rugby behaviour in these blogs, irratating, crazy and worrying to boot. This ardent refusal to accept that your side might be beaten, smacks of football behaviour.
Referee's decisions, the bounce of the ball are part of the rub of the green, sometimes they go for you and sometimes they don't. You deal with it and what's more, by dealing with it you come out the stronger for it.
Come on guys, we are Rugby fans, we love the game for all its unpredictability, look at the shape of the ball for starters - if we wanted it easy it would be round.
As for who deserved to win, that matters not a jot. I was taught to congratulate the opposition on their win, no matter how tough I felt the losing was. So once again congratulations to Ireland and I hope that we will have your support this weekend and be able to do you a favour in Paris.
And please can we cut all this talk of arrogance out. After years of waiting it is finally Ireland's time, I for one wish that we (Scotland, Wales and England) just accept that and be happy for them. Equally I am sure Ireland fans remember what it was like to lose.
Sorry for the rant. Just found this constant bickering, whingeing and general childish behaviour that has become almost a trade mark of these blogs too much and I hope I am not alone. So if you haven't got anything positive to say......... well you know the rest.
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rory cairns- seriously i'm applauding your decency and sense of what is right. as an irish fan, thank you for your sentiments regarding the win. you're obviously not one of the fans who booed irish kicks the other day.it's gotten quite bad on these blogs at the moment between ireland and scotland which is always a rare occurence. i will be rooting for the scots (obviously) at the weekend and i do feel that they can prevent the french from scoring lots of points if not beating them completely!
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Come on Scotland!!
Come on Wales
But most of all COME ON IRELAND!!
As a true Rugby Fan, have been glued to the rollercoaster ride which is the six nations since it started!
Some absolutely spectacular results!
Lets hope next weekend brings thrills, Spills and a whole lot of excitement because after all thats what its all about!
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Come on Scotland!!
Come on Wales
But most of all COME ON IRELAND!!
As a true Rugby Fan, have been glued to the rollercoaster ride which is the six nations since it started!
Some absolutely spectacular results!
Lets hope next weekend brings thrills, Spills and a whole lot of excitement because after all thats what its all about!
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mole, you wrote (#146):
"a public apology from EOS or perhaps some legal action for his slanderous and unfounded allegations?"
the allegations may have been slanderous, but with a person lying unconscious on the ground with his face the colour of a plum they most definitely were NOT unfounded!!
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I don't know how Di Rollo gets 6 and S. Lamont only gets 7. More like Di Rollo 4 S. Lamont 8.
Am I the only person who sees how useless Di Rollo is? He contributes nothing to the team apart from making some tackles. I'm afraid an international outside centre also has to be able to make breaks which he never does.
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