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Wednesday 17 June 2009

Len Freeman | 17:48 UK time, Wednesday, 17 June 2009

Here's Gavin Esler with detalis of Wednesday's Newsnight

"They are the devil's vegetable" - Royal Navy Captain Wayne Keble, who has
reportedly banned Brussels sprouts aboard HMS Bulwark.

In tonight's programme:

In his formal Mansion House speech tonight the Chancellor of the Exchequer will address the issue of British banking culture and regulation.

Ahead of the speech - and therefore subject to correction - Newsnight understands Mr Darling is expected to say that the current regulatory system is not to blame for the economic downturn and that banks' own boards are the first line of defence to prevent another crisis.

Is that good enough? We'll try to find out.

All that plus the latest from Iran - we'll be speaking to Henry Kissinger about the diplomatic response.

And we have the second in Paul Mason's films from his road trip around China examining their response to the economic crisis.

It's an extraordinary film.

Do join me at 10:30.

Gavin

Comments

  • Comment number 1.

    What a bunch of warlocks! isn't devil worship an official recognised religion in the modern RN? Wicca think of that?

  • Comment number 2.

    From the top deck. No. 8. Wednesday, 17 June 2009

    Ayatollah Khamenei .....

    Time to be the Obama-esque Leader for the Islamic State perhaps?

    Commuting .....

    Does anyone know how many people commute from South Northampton to London on a daily basis? Property prices are still so high in the Capitol I would imagine that most couldnt afford to buy unless there was some sort of arrangement whereby a potential purchaser could be extensively subsidised. Perhaps Mr Pickles could offer some advise on commuting?

    Mr Grayling .....

    Has the crime of Sedition been removed from the Statute books?

    Is a the first policy statement from the Conservatives? Or was that the Lisbon Treaty? i.e. Well oppose it unless, of course, it is imposed upon us. By which time all we will do is complain about the commitment alongside implementing the policies. ( Dont want the cake, but Ill eat it anyway. Even if it makes me sick. Doh!

    Irish Romanians .....

    Does anyone suspect that we could be needing the help of a potential national hero with a spare finger?

    Honesty in Public Office ......

    Can anyone name any MP whom in the last 30 years has directly answered the specifics of any directly asked question? ( I cant propose that this be conducted as a competition as I do not think that anyone could possibly win? Or am I just being cynical? )

    Mr Osborne .....

    Surely a prospective Chancellor of the Exchequer would know where 300K profit would come from as a result of a house sale? Just what qualities are required of a Chancellor? Surely if you cant understand the pennies, then the pounds???. Should Mr Bullingdon be asked the question? If yes, dont hang around for the answer.

    VAT .....

    Strange, retailers et al though it was a pointless reduction, but now its a pointless re-instatement! Hmm!

    WFP .....

    Potential statement from .... It isnt really happening, coz we say so!. ( ACAs anybody? )

    NHS .....

    New motto for, in these impoverished times, ......Necessity and need, not desire.

    BNP .....

    Quote .... a big worry for the media ....unquote. Fact .... Ostrich plus sand does not equal longevity of the species.

    Mr Cameron ..... ( AKA ... perhaps .... The gaff-oops-er! )

    Quote .... Absolutely no answer to the question! .... unquote. So, Mr C. Where are the policies?

    Noticeably, still no tory corpses yet been thrown to the wolves? Do cadavers have any real need of a Resettlement Allowance? ( State benefits are means tested .... one rule for them ..... Eat cake!

    How many members of the public have applied to be added to the list of PPCs, aka paratroopers, and how many have actually been added to the favoured stroke ordained 1000? (And how long have they, the paratroopers, been resident in their preferred prospective constituency? Aah! Democracy, dont you just love it?)

    SATs .....

    Teachers are too professional to be biased against individual students .... Discuss.

    Does more choice for parents regarding prospective school places just push up property prices in certain areas, and push them down in others? Why does the word ghettos come to mind.

    Sir Chris Kelly .....

    Is it possible to deny that there are still only 24 hours in a day? When will MPs with their 2nd, 3rd, 4th jobs ever get time to sleep if they are so committed to public service?

    Mr Obama .....

    Please turn yourself in to the US equivalent of the RSPCA, they will be harder on you if they have to issue a warrant.

    Brussel sprouts .....

    Best Raw, in quantity!

    John Simpson .....

    Good old fashioned authoritative beeb reporting. Nice one , John.

    Smoking in cars .....

    Turning on the ignition of a car is the equivalent of two thousand cigarettes being smoked .... Discuss? ( Labours manifesto ... separate smoking areas, anyone remember that? )

    Unemployment .....

    The Ö÷²¥´óÐã, judging by the number of new faces on News 24, seems to be recruiting. Is the Application Form available on the web site?

    192 k are not in receipt of Job Seekers Allowance .... What exactly are they in receipt of?

    The NHS .....(Two)

    Should HMG invest substantial sums in training some of the unemployed in hands-on - as opposed to in educational institutions - nurse training? Perhaps even creating a new qualified nurse grade that is specifically practical orientated?

    Does anybody know what the average BMI is for all Nurses?

    Mr Gove .....

    Enough of the party political slanging - in which apparently the tories never engage(!) - where are the policies?

    Possible tax rises for whom?

    The media .....

    Quote .... we .... have known about ACA [ abuse] for some time .... unquote.

    And some of the GBP have complained to the media about ACA [ abuse] for some time.

    Aah! The power of the press!

    Wunerful, init?

  • Comment number 3.

    "Ahead of the speech - and therefore subject to correction - Newsnight understands Mr Darling is expected to say that the current regulatory system is not to blame for the economic downturn and that banks' own boards are the first line of defence to prevent another crisis.

    Is that good enough? We'll try to find out."


    Somehow, I don't think you will.

    Of course it isn't good enough, but New Labour like the others are clearly dependent on Financial Services. The alternative is capitulation to true Stalinist socialism, and not only is that anathema to New Labour (which is obviously Trotskyite/anarchistic) but socialism in the guise of Old Labour is clearly taboo to the USA as well given what we see in the media, i.e. it's vilified overseas as 'dictatorship', so there's no chance of it gettng anywhere at home even if UNISON and UNITE do protest and withdraw their meagre funding. New Labour, or whatever they shape-shift into in the future, will get funding covertly from the USA or international business to keep this ugly system running.

    "All that plus the latest from Iran - we'll be speaking to Henry Kissinger about the diplomatic response."

    But he's Jewish so hardly neutral, so why not boldly ask the Chinese or Russians who are members of the SCO or even the Indians/Pakistanis, who are clearly hedging.

    Silly request, I guess.

  • Comment number 4.

    'YOU'RE UNACCEPTABLE VS SHUT THE **** UP' POLITICS

    What is going on in Korea?

    The South's president says:

    Lee said as he received an honorary degree at the George Washington University."

    Whilst the North says:

    "If the US and its followers infringe upon our republic's sovereignty even a bit, our military and people will launch a one hundred or one thousandfold retaliation with [a] merciless military strike,"

    Korean politics is very different from British politics isn't it? Our banks effectively bankrupt the country and turn everyone's kids into debt-slaves and the banks just get told:- 'don't do it again please'.

    North Korea develops a bomb whilst their best friends China, Russia have hundreds if not thousands spare across the border - and all hell lets loose. Doesn't make any sense.

    Meanwhile, Ö÷²¥´óÐã NEWS keeps showing very odd pictures of what is going on in Iran, except the pictures are so bad they could have been done/edited anywhere. Who do they think they are kidding?

  • Comment number 5.

    Which is which?

    Reports on Ö÷²¥´óÐã news have been confusing me.






    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 6.

    JAperson (#2) Excellent post - very... uplifting!

  • Comment number 7.



    In other words, they're trying a really really really good Hollywood to pull the wool back over Dorothy's eyes. It's the only thing which makes any sense. If this weren't so, surely US foreign policy would change dramatically, Iraq and N. Korea would be placated, the BNP wouldn't have had such bad press, Darling would be doing something 'Stalinist', nobody would be blaming the Credit Crunch on too much saving by the PRC people, and ....Paul Mason wouldn't have said that the PRC doesn't have a welfare system.

  • Comment number 8.

    #8 JJ

    I take it then you haven't seen the new billboards for Green Britain Day.

    I have not found one picture of them on the web. Take a look at one.

    Are these subliminal?

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 9.

    Is it some sort of bizarre joke to have Henry Kissinger on talking about the Iran situation?

    Is your production team too young to know about the covert bombing campaign over Cambodia by Henry Kissinger. I add "allegedly" because he seems to come over as a man with total memory loss whenever he is asked about it.

    Obviously no one else was available in the White House or Pentagon to do an interview.

    Henry Kissinger is a diplomatic joke.

    To quote Ö÷²¥´óÐã News "Documents recently released by the CIA, strengthen previously-held suspicions that Kissinger was actively involved in the establishment of Operation Condor, a covert plan involving six Latin American countries including Chile, to assassinate thousands of political opponents."




    Ron Taylor


    ----------------------

  • Comment number 10.

    THE BASE MATERIAL OF DEMOCRATIC POLITICS (#2)

    "Can anyone name any MP whom in the last 30 years has directly answered the specifics of any directly asked question? ( I cant propose that this be conducted as a competition as I do not think that anyone could possibly win? Or am I just being cynical? )"

    I was mulling over the self same political parameter. Indeed I recently posted on it. The practice of the 'NON ANSWER ANSWER' is stock-in-trade of the politician. But even the mighty award winning paxman makes no challenge. If all politicians belched or spat, there would be outcry. The Non Answer Answer' is a heinous affront, yet passes unremarked.

    We not only live within a lie but within an insult. It is enshrined in the Westminster ethos, and as prevalent among WOMEN MPs as men. so much for the the Harriet Transformation through 50% women.

    This is such an easy confrontation to have between Newsnight and Westminster - long overdue and damning. It's not going to happen is it! (It would SPOIL MEDIA GAMES.)

  • Comment number 11.

    Enjoyed very much Paul Mason's Caper in China.

    1st Test on Saturday/Top Gear back on Sunday YAA Whoo

    ps I agreed with Clarkson him of 2 Eyes about the 1 eye

  • Comment number 12.

    go1 wrote earlier:

    "Racists attack Romanian women and children - including a five day old baby.

    Such courage.
    I'll bet they even do weights.
    I hope the police and courts throw the book at them if they catch them"

    I take it from your comments that you have never been to belfast. And Martin Mcguiness passing remarks about the racist attacks...just wondering, did you spot the irony/hypocrisy in his comments?

    That bubble that your in...has it got a name? If your ever visit Belfast, take a walk down 'falls road' or take a wander around turf lodge:)..welcome to my birth place!

  • Comment number 13.

    SOLZHENISTSYN (#9) "Obviously no one else was available in the White House or Pentagon to do an interview"

    He did manage to say words to the effect that he didn't think the president/USA would wish to be seen as visibly exacerbating the current situation in Iran ;-)

    Maybe it was just my imagination, but Gavin's face was a picture...

  • Comment number 14.

    WINDOW-DRESSING AND THEATRICS

    barrie (#10) "We not only live within a lie but within an insult. It is enshrined in the Westminster ethos, and as prevalent among WOMEN MPs as men. so much for the the Harriet Transformation through 50% women."

    Hollywood/politics - actors, good at.

    High verbal fluency, social flair, and pulling power a major plus - scientific ability a liability ('pursuit of truth' anathema).

    Womanly attributes/feminized brains much in demand - see Flint and guess who?

    All degrees are not equal.

  • Comment number 15.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 16.

    JJ post 13 Lucky/Unlucky for A some

    Eye 2 clocked Gavins Boat Race

    The I's/Eye's/Aye's/Ee's/Een Have it

    (I refer The HonouRably Lady 2 post 11 above 2)

  • Comment number 17.

    14 All Degrees Are Not Equal (thats A Corker)

    Are you refering 2 gordon broons Broken/Useless/UnWorkAble Moral Compass

    (Naughty Naughty JJ)

  • Comment number 18.

    For balance, see .

  • Comment number 19.

    This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

  • Comment number 20.

    WHEN THEIR WORD IS NO LONGER THEIR BOND

    summed up this country's mass delusion as to rampant anarchism rather well:

    "The Bank finds itself in a position rather like that of a church whose congregation attends weddings and burials but ignores the sermons in between. Like the church, we cannot promise that bad things won't happen to our flock the prevention of all financial crises is in neither our nor anyone else's power, as a study of history or human nature would reveal. And experience suggests that attempts to encourage a better life through the power of voice is not enough. Warnings are unlikely to be effective when people are being asked to change behaviour which seems to them highly profitable. So it is not entirely clear how the Bank will be able to discharge its new statutory responsibility if we can do no more than issue sermons or organise burials."

  • Comment number 21.

    banks to big to fail= privatise the profit and socialise the loss model.

    of course the city wants to keep it. The govt are failing the british people by not dealing with this issue. but then that is why we are here in the first place?

    given the city have trashed the uk finances for 20years which means mass unemployment [maybe for years] and a drop in national progress in terms of state 'investment' in public services it looks to me the city is a net drain on the uk economy. A subsidised nationalised industry that depends upon unlimited backing of risk for them to operate in the current manner.

    the govt failure is a national scandal.

  • Comment number 22.

    #12 the cookieducker
    go1 wrote earlier:

    "Racists attack Romanian women and children - including a five day old baby.

    Such courage.
    I'll bet they even do weights.
    I hope the police and courts throw the book at them if they catch them"

    I take it from your comments that you have never been to belfast. And Martin Mcguiness passing remarks about the racist attacks...just wondering, did you spot the irony/hypocrisy in his comments?

    Yes I did spot the irony. I think Go1 post may have been pointed towards me.

    I have worked in the fields with Eastern Europeans. Me and 250. Most were Polish so it was sensible for me to speak that. But when you ask for the name of something in Polish, the Slovakians are very proud and they also tell you the name in their language.

    Noe some Polish will speak some English. Many Slovakians will speak no English, but due to the geo-politics will speak some Polish. But difficult for English learning Polish to speak to Slovakian in their second language.

    I asked the name of a strawberry plant in Polish, they told me. The Slovakians told me. It sounds like Hahoda. So I said ah Star Wars plant Master Hahoda. The Polish laughed. But I would never forget the name of the plant in Slovakian. But the Slovaks didn't understand what we were laughing about. So the Poles had to translate a Slovakian/English pun back to the Slovakians in Polish so they would understand. Much chattering backwards and forwards to get to the point a pole put their hands together bowed and said ah Master Yoda, then the Slovakians laughed.

    A lad came into our poly tunnel and started picking in someone else's row. I said I don't think this is your row. No response, I tried in Polish. No response. The girl next to me. Polish but spoke English said she taught he was Czech. So she in Polish asked if any one spoke Czech. No response. Not sure what happened next as people are appearing out of the rows like Meerkats. I think a Slovakian heard who didn't speak Czech told his mate in Slovakian, who did speak Czech, who told the Czech. He understood only one word in English and said Thank you and went to his proper row.

    Ukrainians told me in English they liked working in Scotland, because they met Poles. Learning Polish meant they could also learn Russian, which is different to Ukrainian. But is closer to Polish, so through Polish they could learn Russian.

    I could go on bringing other languages to web, but I think I have made my point.

    Go1 How many Eastern European languages can you exist in?

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 23.

    THE H1N1 NON-STORY

    The Ö÷²¥´óÐã needs to brush up on science and logic a bit. Some people die
    after a bee sting or gnat bite but not because bees and gnats are killers. Some people die after falling over, but clearly falling over is not a killer.


    a Ö÷²¥´óÐã article says in its title - but even the body of the article indicates that the death was not directly caused by H1N1 but was due to underlying health problems exacerbated by the flu. If this strain of H1N1 caused deaths, there would be a large number of others with underlying health problems dying too. Furthermore, if this poor woman's death was caused by H1N1 the UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon would not have

    A small point, but in our ever more loose with the truth and hysterical times, an important one.

  • Comment number 24.

    In the Guardian:

    'Gordon Brown can't say he wasn't warned. Today, the former cabinet secretary Lord Butler, will become the latest to criticise the Iraq inquiry announced by the prime minister on Monday.

    In a House of Lords debate today, Butler will accuse the government of "putting its political interests ahead of the national interest".'

    That would seem to be in line with their attitude to bank regulation where they might pick up criticism, expenses and parliamentary and electoral reform.

    Should the Labour mission statement be: "Doing nothing, and not being blamed - decisively!"

  • Comment number 25.

    NOT RETROVIRUS BUT PERHAPS STILL A BIT 'RETRO'

    Apparently the old folk (who get just about anything going, usually) are not vulnerable to the BRAND NEW strain? Perhaps being ultra-modern, it is, by design, a bit retro in its construction, and those of us who ate a lot of dirt in the old days, have 'got it's number'? Might it have rounded corners like 50s fridges or bits of trim like the Odeon? There were lots of bugs in the Odeon - sick on the seats and god knows what trampled into the carpet . . . Enough to immunise anyone.

  • Comment number 26.

    #23 Jaded_Jean

    "The H1NI NON STory"

    From the people who brought us:

    Holocaust "Agnosticism"
    The 99% of climate change scientists who think there is climate change due to human impact are wrong.
    The third tower on 9/11 was destroyed deliberately
    Hitler was a peace lover and people "paint him darkly for party political reasons"
    The BNP are a solution to the UK's problems

    Hopefully the flu pandemic will remain as is and then pass as resistance builds. But being prepared for what could turn out to be a major killer is not hysteria.

    But then you are desperately seeking attention by shock tactics as always.

  • Comment number 27.

    #22 kingcelticlion

    "I have worked in the fields with Eastern Europeans. Me and 250. Most were Polish so it was sensible for me to speak that. "

    Was this before or after you worked on top secret stuff and were getting phone calls to your mother from Nobel prize winners?

  • Comment number 28.

    Where is McBride and does he have a story to tell?

    Not many people in the world can afford to lose their job with no obvious gainful employment in immediate sight and stay off the radar.

    If he is getting help is it from the Labour Party and if so what does that say about their attitude to the House of Commons Committee who would like to talk to him about the smear campaign he was going to launch "alone".

  • Comment number 29.

    #22 kingcleticlion

    "I take it from your comments that you have never been to belfast."
    You allegedly speak many languages but make no sense. What point are you attempting to make?

    If Romanian women, or any other ethnic group, are getting beaten up anywhere it is wrong.

    But sadly it is probably by people who have bought into the far right racist nonsense.

    An example would be Von Bruun, the US American Friend of the BNP, shot and killed a security guard the other day at a Holocaust Memorial in the US. A senseless and depraved killing by a raving anti-Semite who thinks Jews run the world.

    Not surprisingly his views are very similar to those proposed by the fascist posters who frequent this page.

    Fortunately the BNP's history with guns seems to consist of Nick Griffin losing an eye to a shotgun cartridge left in a fire.

  • Comment number 30.

    What is Cameron saying about the Iraq War Inquiry?

    Would he scrap the governments cover up and start again?

    When people like Hutton, Dannatt and Butler have spoken out the line will not hold.

  • Comment number 31.

    Addendum (#7) is worth reading in the context of #7.

  • Comment number 32.

    #22 kingcelticlion

    "I take it from your comments that you have never been to belfast."

    So by the sounds you have been to Belfast, you have far right views and you are unlikely to have been on the Catholic divide.

    I wonder where the poor unfortunates who got brainwashed into acts of thuggery by racial propaganda/race "realism" received their stimulation.

    Any ideas as you are expert on Belfast? Could you help the police with all of your language expertise?

    You also work in fields (hence you are stronger than Tyson?), speak many languages work on Top Secret projects and deal with Nobel prize winners and you told the police about the Tay flooding.

    Meanwhile Jaded_Jean is the "high end" of far right thinking - as cookieducker would say.

    Gosh.

  • Comment number 33.

    thegangofone (#26) "Hopefully the flu pandemic will remain as is and then pass as resistance builds. But being prepared for what could turn out to be a major killer is not hysteria."

    What is it which is preparing people? Do you think this strain will immunise against a later more virulent strain? Or is all the contingency planning essentially a preparatory Civil Defence exercise akin to 'Duck And Cover' (or in the UK, 'take_the_door_off_and_hide_under_the_stairs_to_shleld_you_from_the_effects_of_a_20MT_MIRV').

    You do know what TAMIFLU etc don't do? Those Masters you have - what are they exactly?

  • Comment number 34.

    thegangofone (#29) "a raving anti-Semite who thinks Jews run the world."

    No, No... according to the Ö÷²¥´óÐã, the ex , they do so by proxy.

    Please get your facts right.

  • Comment number 35.

    Who Regulates Who

    If you read this Guardian , followed by this Guardian , I suggest you may see a broader canvas here.

    To me , with my limited knowledge of already established EU competencies , this seems to be a total new transfer of sovereignty in the area of financial regulation.

    I was disappoint with your selection of guests last night as I personally do not believe Mr Cable or Mr Hutton would be too concerned about further transfers of sovereignty to the EU, and Mr McFall would not want a public debate about it. Therefore can I humbly request you invite guests on who hold a more main stream political view on issues relating to the EU.

    Paul In China

    It was informative and enjoyable to watch.

    Thanks

  • Comment number 36.

    go1 at 29:

    You suggest that only some - the BNP - are violent. Our own British govt past and present have blood on their hands as well. Can you comment on our own state sponsored murder? Tony Blair lied for the sake of his own ego and not even for our own interest and hundreds of thousands have died. Who's the fascist? eh..Tony and Bush? oh and what about kissinger.

  • Comment number 37.

    Go1

    Some other posters have suggested you get therapy. Do you read their comments. You appear to have so much hate and anger.

    So many paradoxes. You go on about McBride and 'smearing' people.

    It may be that you need to read comments more carefully. Very often someone posting in this blog will quote and reference a previous poster. Very often you don't read properly and address the person who has quoted a previous comment and not the original post. Mixing author and contents up.

    You consistently attribute words to people they have never said. Do you not understand how dangerous this could be in in wider real world context.

    You seem to think it is funny that someone was blinded in an accident. You not seem understand sympathy, compassion or kindness.

    You say things like you hope the police will throw the book at them. Do you not believe in innocent until proved guilty. Do you not believe in legal representation or courts or a fair and independent trial. Do you want police kicking doors in and them and them alone deciding who is guilty. You seem very extremist and of an aggressive nature. Well that is how you come across in your writing.

    Please start reading more carefully then having done this you will be able to reply more accurately. Once you do this you will get more respect. When you get more respect you don't need to be as angry.

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 38.

    #32 Go1

    You are still doing it. Why will you not accept advice and stop wasting your own time. People may be laughing at you.

    You have wasted a post

    "I take it from your comments that you have never been to belfast."

    In my post 22 I quoted and replied to Cookieducker post 12. I referenced that comment.

    So read post #12 above.

    Now your posts #29 and #32 are directed at Cookieducker not me. So rewrite them to cookieducker.

    I have never been to Belfast. It was cookieducker who was born there.

    Posters before have advised you before how this mentality of attacking Paediatricians instead of paedophiles because people don't read.

    The logical extension of your actions is the dragging of innocent people out of their homes, because you got the wrong person. You have just put a clear and obvious example of your 'blind' hostility.

    Are you now going to apologise to me for getting me mixed up with cookieducker. Thousands of people who read and follow this blog have seen that you have made a mistake. You have confused me with someone else.

    Are you going to apologise to them for your mistake? Many of them are waiting. Sorry is the word they are waiting for.

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 39.

    #20 JJ and what Mervyn King was saying just a few short years ago!

  • Comment number 40.

    I never read any of the Gang of One posts. I, like you Leo find them nonsensical and very angry.

  • Comment number 41.

    YOU CAN'T TRAIN CHICKENS TO WALK BACKWARDS FOR FOOD..BUT...

    thegangofone (addendum to #34) If you pay very close attention, you'll come to see that just as the original (largely Jewish) Bolshevisks operated as anarchists to topple the Tsar and get Russia our of WWI (and the Germans' Eastern front), so too, those who try to 'rule the world' actually do so by undermining other people's states and regulations via anarchism. That is, the way that the free-market spreads is not by people controlling the world, but by anarchists removing regulations, i.e rolling-back governmental power. That is why free-amrketeers describe strong democratic government on behalf of people as dictatorships.

  • Comment number 42.

    ecolizzy (#40) "I never read any of the Gang of One posts. I, like you Leo find them nonsensical and very angry."

    Sensible. I find it intriguing though as he never responds to fair and rational refutation, and he frequently asserts things about others which are clearly just not the csse.

    This behaviour has been commented upon in others elsewhere, and extensively throughout history. It is typical of Jewish political activism (although I suspect it can't be exclusively Jewish). Truth does not figure in such activism. Inappropriate, or extreme emotion also characterises the behaviour. It is quite a clever tactic, as people are lured in, believing otherwise, and that a rational responses will make a difference. See Kevin MacDonald on this. It is not entirely clear that the behaviour is consciously dishonest. That's what some find so intriguing. It's as if there's a blind-spot to rational analysis. It attracts attention, and it causes trouble.

  • Comment number 43.

    Green Revolution

    I am trying to find pictures of the Government's etc Team green billboards. Unfortunately I can't fing on the net.

    So try this another similar logo from the same team. Is that a subliminal message appearing on the 'top left of the flag'.



    It is very striking when you see the full flag on a billboard. Green Revolution, haven't I seen something on the news about that in the last few days.

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 44.

    A few years ago the Mexican election, which was much closer than the Iranian one, was won by the rightist party in very suspicious circumstances.

    Remember the massive Ö÷²¥´óÐã reporting on that one? Me neither.

    There seems to be an attitude in the Ö÷²¥´óÐã that it is democracy if the western supported candidate wins, no matter how suspiciously. Remeber all the complaints when "our" candidate won in Georgia with an unbelievable 96% - me neither again. If the side "we" don't like wins then, even by the same 12 million Dinnerjacket did last time, they say it is a fix.

    Wish the Ö÷²¥´óÐã were equally worried about postal vote ele3ctroal fraud in Britain but it seems not.

  • Comment number 45.

    ecolizzy (#39) "JJ and what Mervyn King was saying just a few short years ago!"

    As MigrationWatch and many others have said for a long time now, it isn't the East Europeans who are the problem. They have an even lower birth rate than we do and they will go home when the economies here and there equilibriate. The problem is S.Asians and Africans. They come, they stay, and they breed. This is the reason why over 99% of London's population growth over the next 30 years will be in BME groups. If these groups were equally in mean abilty to the indigenous population, or even if it were the case that through state education we could level the playing field, many would have no objections, I certainly wouldn't as they could just be welcomed as making up for the birth dearth. But the evidence is quite the contrary, and given their higher birth rates, the relationship between skills and contribution to a sustainable economy, as well as criminogenic risk and dependence of welfare, it's a socio-economic disaster in the making which benefits nobody but the multinationals like TESCO which can and will open stores elsewhere, i.e move on. That's exactly what they will do after they have hoovered up what they can from our gullible population, I fear. It's already starting to happen.

  • Comment number 46.

    KingC3lticLion (#43) Greens are made-over communists ('watermelons'). But note, they're internationalists, i.e. anti-statists. They are one-worlders. Like everything else internationalist, it just serves to cripple states - great for the free-market.

  • Comment number 47.

    THE BOTTOM LINE (#36)

    "Tony Blair lied for the sake of his own ego" - precisely -

    and IDS secured the lie.
    Tony is among the stars now, but IDS is still down here on cow-pat Britain. I reckon we shoud get the Paxo Inquisition to work IDS over with some deftly applied hot glaring, until IDS re-affirms that he was dazzled by Ol' Hobtooth Blair. You bring down a monumental lie, starting with a small crack at the weakest point. Go Paxo.

  • Comment number 48.

    go one and MultiPly

    I have 2 agree with other posts ear.

    However you hae given The Cameronian AmmuNITion against brown.

    IE post 24 (DOING NOTHING AND NOT BEING BLAMED)banks/elections/iraq enquiry/british jobs for british people/crime/sacking mpees/etc etc etc etc etc etc bla blah bla blah

    one month later etc etc etc etc blah bla blah bla

  • Comment number 49.

    JJ 45 its called Paying Tax on/for The great washed/unwashed/spongers 2 include politicians national and local/criminals from home or abroad

    You Pay/Feed Them, NOT ME SISTER (I will Eat my own head first)

  • Comment number 50.

    CL #43

    "Is that a subliminal message appearing on the 'top left of the flag'."

    Just grabbed that image - it's a perfectly innocent JPEG. I was wondering if maybe it was an animated GIFF from what you said. I couldn't find anything 'sinister' [sic] about it though. Don't know what browser you are using but most have a view>source option which will show you the code. There are some references to Flash movies but they all seem innocent enough. What are you suspicious of? Use of subliminal images is more or less banned in this country now. Can't get away with it in advertising any more.

  • Comment number 51.

    PAXO'S PARADOX

    barrie (#47) "You bring down a monumental lie, starting with a small crack at the weakest point. Go Paxo."

    He won't do that. There's nothing to replace what goes on here at present. Statism is in retreat and whilst statism pays for the Ö÷²¥´óÐã, progressive anarchism is the only one game in town and has been for decades. Oddly, anarchism is consistent with your Independentism :-(.

    Odd as it may seem, challenging those who are engineering this economic anarchism threatens the current infrastructure which still pays their salaries. The architects use the Ö÷²¥´óÐã today as a propaganda portal.

    Chalenging what they do is too high risk for an insider. Some people say the Ö÷²¥´óÐã is pro socialist. It would be logical to be so, but as there is no longer a socialist party in Britain, making socialist noises just puts their careers at risk.

    That's my take on this sorry mess. Independents are not the answer.

  • Comment number 52.

    CL #43

    I think Kawasaki have some grounds for complaint there. Calling themselves Team Green indeed! ;-)

  • Comment number 53.

    #43 Mr Lion, All I see on this site is an big advert for EDF!!!

  • Comment number 54.

    #50 New Fazer

    I think you are looking too hard. My fault. When you see the flag on a bill board it looks like the Stars and Stripes have been morphed together with the Union Jack.

    Perhaps sub-liminal may have been the wrong word to use. It gets professionals poking about with source code etc. When you next go into the big city or metropolis from your "Hobbit Hole busy, thriving village in the 'privileged' south east!" Have a look at it on one of those things they stick big advertsing posters on.

    Have a look now think stars and stipes.



    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 55.

    New Fazer

    Perhaps while we are in dialogue. From the North of the Border could we have some comment on the line.

    "I don't live in some out of the way cave half way up a mountain near Fort William"

    Are you trying to portray some racial sterotype of us? Is this it?



    I trust you will know the full title............we sure know how to party


    Celtic lion

  • Comment number 56.

    Just checking -no response yet from Go1

    darkened room, staring into the bottom of a glass, music on



    Ah well

  • Comment number 57.

    CL #55

    I chose Fort William as that is where my mother came from. Like you, I too am half Scottish. Fort William is a lovely place but the other reason for my choice lay in the coverage maps for Ö÷²¥´óÐã radio transmitters, the large blank area surrounding the immediate vicinity - "near Fort William"!

    Here's tae us
    Wha's like us
    Damn few,
    And they're a' deid
    Mair's the pity!

    ;-)

  • Comment number 58.

    #57 New Fazer

    I am sorry for my post #55. Please accept my apologies. Now you have explained the actual reasons for the line in your comment. I understand the rational behind it. And it was in no way an attempt at racial stereotyping.

    I was mistaken in jumping to the wrong conclusion. I hope I have caused no offence and that you can accept my apology.

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 59.

    Post 58 KCL The Biggest MiStake o My Life.

    I have only Voted 3 times in my Life I am 52/3

    1997 you guessed it I voted for the HIT s from GlasGOw (move the s aboot)

    My Grammer School Mate/Mucker/Opo reminds me everytime we Speak

    I would like 2 Apologies 2 Everyone on The PLANet for being an Idiot.

    (keeping in the Spirit of your 58 KCL, go1 take note)(easy init)

  • Comment number 60.

    Dear Mod your Profanity Filter is out of tune with Local Dialects

  • Comment number 61.

    #59 dAllan169

    I am sure your apology will be accepted by many. Who have yet to apologise.

    But was it just trying to make the best of a bad job.

    Chances are whoever you put your cross by they would be a politician, and the Government always gets in.

    Celtic Lion

  • Comment number 62.

    Post sixtae 1/Toe the line one

    The best of A bad Job is not quite good Enough is it.

    Depends on the Cross and the Meaning BeHind it.

    GoverMeant = GO Vommit

    The PenduLUM Swings dont ye think

  • Comment number 63.

    NN speak 2 old hill

    green house gas/he is full of It

  • Comment number 64.

    Deer hill CONcern about cliMate change = CONcern about collecting Tax

    FLipp your house Flipp OFF

  • Comment number 65.

    CL #58

    No need to apologise my friend, no offence taken. I was having a rant at the time and was not careful enough in my detail. I owed you the explanation.

    The Scots and the English have never sat too comfortably together and, sadly, my accent isn't too welcome up that far these days. And they don't stop to ask what your mother's name was.

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